Josh Biro ~ Secrets of Success: Balancing Yoga Practice and Business Mastery

In this enlightening episode of the Native Yoga Toddcast, host Todd McLaughlin is joined by Josh Biro, the dynamic founder of Yogapreneur Collective. Josh dives deep into the integration of yoga practices with entrepreneurial ventures, providing invaluable insights for yoga studio owners and business enthusiasts. With a background embedded in both yoga and business from an early age, Josh shares his transformative journey from a reluctant yogi to a thriving entrepreneur. The conversation is rich with practical advice on reconciling the seemingly contrasting worlds of yoga and business, and offers a fresh perspective on adapting to the ever-evolving landscape of yoga entrepreneurship.

Visit Josh on his website: https://yogapreneurcollective.com/
Subscribe to his YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/@yogapreneurcollective

Key Takeaways:

• Integration of Yoga and Business: Josh highlights the importance of reconciling yoga practices with business operations to create a sustainable and impactful yoga studio.
• Cashflow Management: The necessity of managing cashflow effectively to maintain and grow a yoga business is stressed as the foundation of operational success.
• Technology and AI in Yoga Businesses: Insights on leveraging AI and automation to enhance efficiency, customer service, and market adaptability, without losing the human touch.

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Transcript

0:33

Welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast. So happy you are here. My goal with this channel is to bring inspirational speakers to the mic in the field of yoga, massage bodywork and beyond. Follow us @nativeyoga and check us out at nativeyogacenter.com. All right, let's begin Welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast. My name is Todd McLaughlin, and today I bring to you special guest, Josh Biro. Josh is the founder of the Yogapreneur Collective. You can find him on his website, https://yogapreneurcollective.com. You can find him on his YouTube channel at@yogapreneurcollective. And you can also find him on Instagram at @yogapreneurcollective. Remember, you can follow us at Native Yoga Center and@nativeyoga and all our social media channels. All right, I'm so excited for you to be here. Because let me just ask you a couple questions. Are you a yoga teacher wanting to make a living and improve your ability to make a living as a yoga teacher? Are you a yoga practitioner? And you go to a yoga studio and or you operate with an online platform and you're curious, what are the behind the scenes elements that go into actually maintaining a yoga studio and or a collective that can make it possible for all of us to get together and practice yoga and share ideas and grow and learn? Well, this episode is for you because we cover a lot of the nitty gritty details of the essentials for a successful yoga business and or successful business in general. And I'm just really happy and honored to have this opportunity to speak with Josh Biro. Remember, check them out, follow them and we hope you enjoy. Let's begin. So happy to have the chance to meet and speak with Josh Biro is the founder of Yogapreneur Collective. You can find him at yogapreneurcollective.com. Josh, I'm so excited to have this chance to meet you. How are you doing? Excellent. Todd. Thanks for having me on. I'm super excited to chat today. Thank you. You help. yoga practitioners, yoga teachers and yoga studio owners succeed in business. How did you get started with all this? Yeah, the superhero origin. So you know, I am a reluctant yogi. Even to this day, I grew up in a yoga family. My dad was super into it. Started out in the Ashtanga world a little bit. I think my first couple classes more publicly, I was like maybe 13. But I was the stiff hockey player and Canadian boy. So I just thought like, this isn't fun. It hurts. I only had to do that my dad. And my dads were like inappropriately tight small shorts. Like, why are we doing this? Yeah. We got other things to do. But, you know, long story short, sort of dabbled got back into it. Maybe around 1920, mostly for my wife that into Bikram yoga at the time, the heat was just like, the missing element for me to figure out how to move and use my body properly. Fast forward again, after a few teacher trainings, managing building selling a studio. My wife and I went traveling full time in an RV. I like to say like we did the van life thing before it was cool. Yeah, people were like, what, like you're gonna drive around with your kids in the van. But during that time, there's sort of like, an end right prior to these two epiphany moments that happened for me. So one was, when we set out opening our big studio in Canada, the intention was to build community, and then also to spread like, what we had experienced is such a life altering practice to other people who just felt like called to do that. And if you can make a living doing that, like why would you not that this makes logical sense. Yes. I was always really surprised by how much resistance to the business part we were met with though. Like yoga plus business people would even say like, well, those go together. We got turned down by like seven banks, even though we fit all criteria for the funding, because you're like, well, you're gonna have to make money. So I'll let you cut in there. Talk a little bit. Oh, no, that's cool. I Yeah, I'm with you know, I was agreeing with you that maybe Then banks look at yoga practitioners like they can't be good at business. They're their yoga practitioner. How could they be good at business? Yeah. So that's interesting. Yeah. Was it a Bikram studio that we did open? So pretty cool studio? Yeah. Yeah. And you know, it's funny too, because Oh, that was in Red Deer, Alberta. Cool. Canada. Yeah. You know, if yoga is huge yoke, connect union. And you can extend that, in my opinion to say yoga is everything. How is business not yoga and yoga, not business. And in other ways, and we can get into it. Yogi's tend to be excellent business people, we that's why we say yoga printer, once they personally reconcile the fact that the business is not at odds with their yoga practice. But the point here was, you know, we built up this big community, and then we had a family tragedy, and we lost the daughter, four days before her second birthday. And like a freak accident. Oh, my gosh. And that's the kind of thing that like, you can't prep for that in life. You know, that, that fucks. You up? Yeah. And I can tell you straight up. Like, if I didn't have this sort of spiritual practice I had, if I didn't have that yoga practice, base behind me to sort of grab on to. And then by extension, on the business side, if we didn't have this community that really, like really rallied around us when we needed it. I don't know if I'd made it. There's so many other paths that moment, oh, my gosh. So it's to me yoga plus business like that was the personal proof of like, this is something even more powerful than they originally thought back to the van life, and we're traveling around. And we stopped counting studios that maybe 125, or something like that. But what became very apparent, which to me was weird, was how often we would encounter a studio that was had all of the formula for what could be a good business there, but then was struggling like unnecessarily. And that just didn't make any sense to me. So I had already been training sales teams, that studios at that point, but that was the impetus to like really go into the sort of coaching side on the business, because I feel like even to this day, that's the best thing I can offer to help yoga continue to grow and inspire and help people. Nice, amazing. What was your business history background prior to the opening of your own studio? Yeah, I mean, I kind of, I guess I grew up in a bit of an entrepreneurial family. My dad always had small businesses, like my first job outside of mowing lawns, or whatever from my grandparents was my dad, it was a chimney sweep. So I would finish school and then we would drive in this old like 79 International pickup truck, and literally climb on the roof and sweep the chimneys. So you know that that taught me shitty dirty work. This is what what was required there. Had a couple of my own businesses earlier on a sort of scoop of company, at one point, a cleaning company. But it really was the yoga studio where like, finally kind of was able to pull these things together. Because we had managed a couple studios helped build a couple of studios when we finally opened ours. You know, the vision when he first opened a yoga studio for most Yogi's, I think it was probably similar. Ours was like, I was like, going through the couch cushions to find nickels. You know, like, how did we get this thing open. But the vision was, if we can open the doors, teach all the other classes will sleep in the back of the studio, if we have to, and eat some, you know, eat some tofu and have a kombucha at the end of the day, like life is good that that was the end of the line sort of thing. Yeah. But once we got up and going, it became very apparent that like, that vision has to first off that's not a full vision for a business that's just getting open. But it has to expand because the demand is there. And it's really like are the bigger mission or the bigger thing to fulfill our obligation, I suppose is to make the business healthy so that we have the vehicle to be able to help the people who are coming to us asking for it. Yes, in the extreme as a tangent I you know, the comments about this business yoga juxtaposition is always like, if there's no reciprocity in it, then your enthusiasm wanes and it can't help anyone or worst case scenario, like if you can't pay the bills, fix the toilet, keep the lights on and you're not helping anybody. So, yes, we always say like, you know, the business. Businesses, especially yoga studios, are unique in our culture, because they really are our vehicles of change. They're the thing that we can utilize is a tool, let's say, to take something that's revolutionary and bring it to the mainstream, like, create respectability around it. Great point. Yeah, I agree. You're right. That's my vision for studio. Yeah. Yeah. So to your question, I just had business courses or whatever. And in couple years of university for I dropped out, I worked in logistics in marine biology and stuff, had some my own businesses. Now don't have an MBA, I didn't do anything like that it was all on the ground real time. So our business went from, you know, paying the bills, and everything's fine. To then we, when I kind of got really serious about I need to crack the code of how does the business of yoga work, and really went after looking for mentorship and helping that, which, at the time was really hard, there's kind of nobody. I think we doubled and then doubled again, a bit less in the first couple of years after that point, and then had like, a consistent like, 20% year over year growth. And then sold, you know, bought a house, a couple cars had kids like the whole like it's supported our lives. I just thought that's what it meant only yoga studio. So that's why when you're traveling, I was kind of floored. I'm like, What do you mean, you're in a town of like, eight times the size? The one we were in? And you're not sure you're gonna pay this staff next month? That doesn't even make sense. Yeah. So interesting. I hear you, man. Well, that's that's what a cool journey to actually go travel by van and visit, like you said, somewhere around over 100 different studios and get that sort of broad angled view of what works, what doesn't work? What was one of the consistent things that you saw that. And I think you already brought up the fact that once we reconcile in our own minds, that yoga and business can go together, and I don't have to turmoil with that every day, every time I have to make a decision about how to, you know, profit more, or make it grow? What was one of the main kind of thing couple things or thing that you saw that people just kept making mistakes out? Or just just was like, a real classic stumbling block? Yeah, yeah, that's a really good question. It's changed, I should say, after physically, like getting to physically be on the ground. So many studios is anyone now traveling studios, is always interesting, because you can kind of feel the studio, we used to say, like, I can go to a studio and teach a class, run the front desk of the class, take a class and tell you a lot about what's going on in that business kind of instantly. And, but then, you know, we also work with businesses online, across basically all English speaking markets. I've got my team of coaches as well. So we kind of have their hive, Hive minds together to talk about all this. Yeah. So if I consolidate all of that together, one of the first things is what you're actually Well, the first thing is that you shouldn't be optimizing for business at all. I mean, I think people see even even to this day, like, it's less and less, but even to this day, people get on a call with us. And they really have this vision of like, you know, the do gooder passion, art lead, I just want to save the world with some yoga. And if I do a really good job, people will come like the product speaks for itself kind of thing. And I'm not casting any shade on that. You need that, in fact, but or, and rather, you also need to, like, be smart in the business side of things. So the first thing, the mistake is like not thinking that you have a business will even hear it in language. I've heard actual franchise brands say this, like, Oh, I know, we're a franchise, but really, we're more of a family. Or like the studio being like, No, we're not a business. We're a community. And you're like, Yeah, I mean, you're an LLC. Yeah. Yes. So that would be number one. Hyper practical, though. cashflow, the way I look at it yoga business, you could, you know, we try to approach it as holistic as you what your yoga practice, breath, body spirit mind. But the first thing is breath, actually, you can do a yoga posture. But if you're not breathing according to the prescribed posture, you diminish the benefits and you can't stay there very long and everything else falls apart. So from a yoga teacher standpoint, it's like what would you tell a student when they first come into any other class? Get on the mat and breathe? Move your body a little bit? Like that's it, it's just breathe? Yes. If you take them to the business side, I would say that breath is to Yoga with cash flow is to a yoga business. So practically speaking, it's trying to make a sale or trying to get more dollars per person or trying to make it more accessible and pricing or whatever, like all of these things that we hear about. But really the first thing that optimize your yoga studio for any other business is cashflow. You have whatever, 30,000 a month in expenses, you have 40,000 a month and MRR. Guess what you can breathe, which means you relax, which means you stay grounded and centered, which means you can apply your creativity and create the other special sauce you have. Yes. Great point. Good point, my wife and I, we've had our studio here in Florida for last 18 years. And we're we're loving doing it and so happy to do it. And I feel like it is a ton of work, right? It's like, it's we're here every single day. And COVID was an incredible challenge, we had to let go of a lot of teachers and just like almost restart the business over again and just come in from the ground floor and like teach every single class and I feel like things have really improved since then this last year, we had one of our best years since the kind of fallout of COVID. But I meet a lot of people that open and close studios regularly. And my advice for them is like you got to really love what you do. Like definitely don't open a studio. If you are, I guess I let me bring this up and see what you think sometimes I say to people I'm making my languaging is completely off with this. And I can already know what your answer is going to be. But sometimes I'll say like yoga teacher trainings like teacher trainers, when they go, I just want to open a studio, I'll say, Well, you know, you really got to love it first, because you're not going to make a ton of money doing it. Like you have to really love it because you like it's tough. It's hard to make it every single month. So but I understand I kind of can guess where you're gonna go. But how would you answer me? Yeah, well, my story aside, I've got a studio owner right now they've been in business for the coming on 17 years business been around for a while. And, you know, they've built the business up single location studio grows over seven figures. And they live with their family in Costa Rica. Or even their nice, don't teach a class no one I was like half the new people coming in don't even know who I was a studio anymore. Wow, or another owner I can think of in another city. Studio has been there a long time over 20 years at this point. She's so removed from the business, you can go in and take class and some of her teachers don't know who she is, like, unless someone points her out. And same thing like that's their primary family income, one location. And then that's not even talking about multi locations or, or, you know, adding different product lines, etc. So, I think that, to your point, like, the nature behind that comment is a positive one in the warning of truth. It's like we want to speak truth. And we want to speak to the fact that you're right. Being an entrepreneur in any business, but a yoga studio is the best testing ground is a little bit like deciding you're gonna get up every morning and have someone punch you in the face and then get up and do it again tomorrow. And that's weird. And as a yogi not exactly what you want to be doing. Right. So I think that I think that the the truth of that being positive, the financing side of it, or what's possible as an outcome. The problem is that there are these narratives, especially negative business narratives that are perpetuated in the yoga world. And it's not that they're untrue, but rather, they're not imbalance. If someone is crushing it, like if you own a yoga studio, and you have 30% margin on the gross and you personally are taking out 20% And you're doing $800,000 a year in sales. And you're 30 years old, like that's a great business by any account whatsoever. You're not going to Facebook, yoga teachers group and be like, Guess what, guys crushing it, like no one's talking about that. So it's kind of like, lopsided weight or like an overweighted narrative to the struggle part of it. I felt like I've spent a lot of my career fighting against that, try to bounce it back out and just say like, yeah, you're right. Like it can be really shitty and hard. And there are moments you're gonna have to hustle and grind and when you first opened, you're probably flying by the seat of your pants. That's all normal. But that's that's kind of part of the fun shouldn't get to in a second. Yeah. But it doesn't mean that you should accept that as the truth of how it will be period. Great point. I mean, the the mindset is so tremendous, right? I mean, what a huge you have to have the mindset in place. I appreciate you saying that. I'm appreciate hearing this thank you do in relation to the trend that's evolved from brick and mortar under two online courses, online teacher training, I noticed that like, we were charging in the past, say, for a 200 hour teacher training could be anywhere between like 2000 to$3,000. And I know some go higher than that. And we can go online right now and type in for yoga online teacher training for$100. And, and obviously, there's quality versus quantity and and, you know, is the quality, you know, you might have to pay more to be in a studio with teachers that have been at it for a long time, and therefore, the quality of the experience will be a little greater than if you just watch a couple of videos and then answer yes, no. ABCD and then get a certificate. But um, what are you witnessing in relation to that broad perspective of multiple businesses and the online world? In like, what which way? Do you recommend going these days? What what are you seeing is work? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I mean, I'm, I'm not wanting to usually say that there's like a one size fits all, there are a few like best business practices, trends, things that we see that like, to me makes sense, because they're really just based out of, like human behavior. So the example being as it stands today, in my opinion, and I think most Yogi's who practice regularly would agree, nothing will completely replace me being in the physical class with you leading the class paying attention, engaging me holding the space, the sound, the vibe, the energy, that's all of it, you know, like, that has a unique value. And actually COVID Did everyone a favor because yoga, if we look at the pricing of your monthly yoga membership since 2005, all the way up to 2019, it doesn't go up, like it stays the same. And inflation goes up. It even goes down in some markets. The point oh, we had a, you had a weird pricing problem. And part of that was the public had the wrong frame. And we did this to ourselves, we rhetorically the overworld, we've kind of accidentally devalued what we were doing in our attempt to make things accessible and inclusive. And we in my opinion, misappropriated with those words. So in any case, COVID van reframed for a lot of people like wait, now that I can't go into the studio, and I can have you in front of me, and I can have the teacher holding it, and I don't like the zoom thing and the online thing or whatever. Now, coming out of it, there's a higher perceived value in the actual in person stuff. So I do think that's one sort of element of this, they don't see going anywhere. So when people say stuff, like, you know, yoga studios are getting eaten up by online stuff, I don't see that I don't see why that would happen. Yeah, I think bad businesses will die off because businesses die off if they're not good. But I don't think it has anything to do with those being at odds. The online stuff, I think, you know, I think it's smart to be aware of it. I mean, I think about my son as a 13 year old son, and like, his life is his phone, and his computer and his like, you know, his whole reality. And I didn't grow up like that. So I almost can't relate to it. Like, I'm almost naive to his perspective of reality via these things. And we're a family that, you know, is pretty open about it, but but is very conscious of like that not being the only reality is existing in as well. So I do feel like online, virtual stuff will continue to grow. And I think where it can potentially be powerful for business right now is to supplement or add more value. It's like a way that you can create something that's more evergreen for your business. If you're gonna go just digital, that's an option too. And that kind of decision to say that it does or doesn't work. I can give you 20 examples of words, that doesn't work. And does, you know, yeah, that's really more like you as a person behind the scenes like, who are you? And also, what are you trying to create? Like, what are you trying to build? In your business? What kind of business are you trying to build? Or you're trying to build an online business then? Cool, but that's like a really different endeavor than a physical studio, or even hybrid for that matter. Yes. Yeah. Yeah, I was gonna add to the teacher training thing. It's not it's like almost its own branch of conversation. Yeah, it's a it's a weird thing where I in another life much earlier, I was a scuba instructor. So I went through, like, every scuba training you could do basically at the time. And then I remember I went in, worked in Thailand for like, I don't know, six, three months or six months or something like that. Teaching scuba diving, and they're like, it became like this job like if you were traveling around at that time, If you're like, Oh, I'm a dive master. I'm a dive instructor like everybody was. Because there was like, it was just a system of creating them. So that certification didn't hold any respect it didn't like actually mean that you knew anything. The Yoga World and teacher trainings have done as with being a yoga teacher, like everyone's yoga teacher is how it seems. And we're seeing the ShakeOut of that now. Yeah, in a couple different ways. Yes. So one is because there's no governing body. And like, this is an unpopular opinion. I don't actually have any like, again, not to cast any shade. But like yoga Elias doesn't, it doesn't mean anything. It's just this is a made up thing. So we're gonna put some letters behind the name, you know, so they can take your 20 bucks or whatever. So even that the closest thing to certification program we have like there isn't, isn't really any governing body that's serious. That's like licensing or something. So say your yoga teacher itself doesn't count for anything. And the spillover is that now is a D value in the sort of lifestyle of becoming a yoga teacher. So as you see less demand, there's more inventory to take yoga, teacher training, so prices go down. And it's kind of simple supply and demand stuff. Yeah. And the really weird thing is the first time in my time doing yoga business, where we're seeing in a lot of markets, like a real shortage of teachers. There's just they're not enough yoga teacher, like there's enough certified teachers out there in the world, for sure. But for a studio to get, oh, like, ordinary culus, people don't just want to really teach and it's like honing their craft. It's hard right now in some markets to really hard. A great point. You're absolutely right, I'm gonna agree with everything you said, all the way through, going all the way back to when you started naming the pricing trend up to 2019, the realization of the value of importance, the ability to increase without the fear of being accessible. And just coming true to the fact that if I want to survive and be thriving, this is what it takes. And then also what you're saying too, about the teacher trainings, you got your finger on the pulse, I agree with everything. And it's interesting, too, that there's a gluttony of yoga certified individuals, and a shortage of finding good teachers that actually want to show up and get really excited about doing it on a consistent basis. So where's our solution? What's that's it, we definitely listed the problems. We got our problems handled now. And how do we fix it? Yeah. And yeah, what are I liked on your website? You said, like, what, what are what are the three things why you you don't want to work with us? You know, like, why, and one of them was that this isn't a quick fix all like a get a get rich quick, and it's not going to fix everything. There's like a we have to source out solutions and continuously find solutions, which I really appreciate that you're being honest and real about the business reality. You know, you have to constantly be moving and shifting and being willing to try new things. And and that's what keeps it going. But any other short, any solutions that you're finding you're coaching your clients on that that are working these days? Yeah, I mean, on the most macro level, we use, like, our framework is called on V opener framework, which is just like that's what we've developed over over a decade now. But it's not like a program A to Z, you just do exactly this. It's rather a framework of like, we know, we need to look at all of these things. And then we need to apply a critical thinking mindset to it, just like your yoga posture, I already know you called triangle, I know what we're doing. But then I have to enter the posture with consciousness. And then I have to be holding the stillness enough to see what's happening in my body right now today and then adjust. So the business exactly the same thing, we already know that you're gonna have to figure out cashflow. We already know more or less the path towards that. But the specificity is unique to your studio. So it's really like looking at it from that critical thinking mindset. Yes, this is a long, long winded way of saying the difference between like a small business owner and a yoga entrepreneur is that a small business owner loves what they do. And want to become an entrepreneur, the entrepreneur, you learn to love what it takes. So I'll set the comment that you'll hear that is different is instead of saying I do or don't like doing this thing in my business, therefore I will or won't do it. Like that's not even the conversation anymore. I'm attempting to call Don't wish this thing in my business. And this is the hurdle that I need to solve for. That's the transition. Yeah. And when you've done that, then wanted really put a lot more joy back into what you're doing. But I think also, how do we saw this, it really is realizing that if you look at if you're a yoga studio, for example, or even if you're a teacher doing your own teacher thing, and you look out into the market, or you look down the street at what other people are doing, and you say, well, that guy is doing that. So I'm going to try that or their price like this, or will do that, or, Oh, they offered that. So maybe I'll try it, or someone told me that things popular. This teacher told me their class over there, it's good. I'll do it to the yoga world's always operated like that. It's a little obsessive, it's actually the problem is you don't know if they're making money. Nobody's working? Like unless you're gonna walk down there and ask them like, Hey, Todd, I see the end of this new class, like, what's your margin on that? And are you going to tell them, you know, like, there's a little tension there, too. So it's a little bit more of like, again, I everything I know a business, I know it from yoga. Yeah, there's a class of 30 yoga students, and you can look around and see what Iran is doing. But you don't know how they're feeling in the posture. And really, that's none of your business. It doesn't matter. You're doing your yoga practice. So it's your business, it is good to know what's happening in the market. But then at some point, how do you solve this, you have to look at what are you trying to do? What's the current issue that you're experiencing? That would be blocking that from happening? And what are the possible paths forward for that? And then you start testing, yes. Great point, agreed 100%. In relation to tools that we are gaining access to, and the speed with which technology is advancing? What would you say is one of the most powerful tools as a yoga teacher and or studio owner? Do we have at our fingertips now? And that we that you feel we should start engaging with? Yeah, I know, this is leaping. We're getting to we're getting to the AI, conversation and automation stuff. So honestly, that's even jumping ahead of the nature of the question because, bluntly, the eight out of 10 Yoga business owners, like they know what AI is, they're probably gonna come chat GPT and type some things in. But it's like they're leapfrogging over all these other things. It's barely even. They're not, they're considering it as like this interesting thing that's happening, rather than realizing we're talking about, on a fundamental level changing what work looks like completely. This is this is the internet 9095. Yeah. So the reason that matters to go back to our previous point, like, what are some of the solutions? Well, if you want the best teachers, the A players, you're going to have to pay them. Because if I'm a yoga teacher, and I'm really great, and my class is full, and I get a following, and I build myself up and do my online thing, at some point, it's not advantageous to work for you. So that's the natural tension of the equation, which just means as a studio, you've got to be able to pay them. But it doesn't mean that we empower them by saying, like, I'm enslaved to my employee that pay you more because they need you so desperately, please teach a yoga class for me, we still have to maintain like, this is the brand and the expectations here. The ability to pay them comes from what you're able to charge your clients and the volume of cash that you have coming in, etc. So it's like, you pull one letter, and this moves in this one there. So the whole equation is like, recalibrating. Honestly, when we talk about technology, and AI, this is an interesting time, because if I come in, and most of us would have an intro pass, you know, maybe two weeks or a month or something like that. What happens like and I purchase it, what happens next, like what happens for those 30 days, and this is obvious stuff for a lot of people listening, I'm sure. But if I have purchased that 30 day pass with you, I've also in some way opted in to participating with you for 30 days, that participation is not only just in a studio, so do you follow me? Do you text me do send me an email? People say I don't want to spam people with email. You're right. You shouldn't spam people with email. But that doesn't mean don't email them. Like if you're sending someone an email and you think it's spam, it's because the content of your email is shit. Not because you sent an email, and then how many emails you've sent. And then the other thing is like, what are you going to write the emails manually and click Send on your Gmail account? No way. You've got to automate that. Then there's a response. So it's the automation component of it where it's like your cup pasady to do work is increasing, where the AI stuff comes in and starts to get fascinating. Now, even if we're talking about on the basic level of like, this lets you go from zero to first draft in half time. For something that you would have done in the past, it's almost like without another person, you can have a sounding board as well. So where it comes in is, in this exponential increase in your capacity to do work, there's only three ways to grow your business, you can increase the number of people coming in your leads, can increase the value per person, your lifetime value, or you can increase your capacity to work. Capacity is literally the number of people you can handle. But it's also you and your team's capacity, like how much work can you get done in the same amount of time? You might have the same number of hours in a day. So if I outperform if we both work eight hours, like if you work 16, and I work eight, but we get the same amount of work done. Are you a harder worker than me? Are you just telling me that you're not as you're not as smart at working right? When we both work the same, the same eight hours, but I get this result, and you get that result times for one of us is doing better work. So we've talked about capacity of work, increasing capacity, it's a little bit efficiency, but it's also just like, mental energetic capacity speed, as well. So that's where some of these tools are really automation and AI is now a component that are really becoming fascinating and empowering, I think, can you give an example that you are seeing yoga studios? What to what capacity is the AI seemingly working? Well, like for example, I'm noticing every single software that I integrate with be it be it zoom be otter AI, be it decipher, be it mind body online via all these different software's they're all giving me the option, my email my Constant Contact, let us write the email for you type in a few words that you want to write about. And it's incredible, because if you use that little prompt, and it gets the ball rolling it just like sometimes I'll be sitting there going, what the heck am I going to talk about today, but if it just helps me get the ball rolling, I can go in and clean it up, come through it. And then boom, I like I got it done. And I'm finding it's working out amazing. But I'm just curious what, and I know it's very specific, based on what skill and what job you're attempting to achieve. But is there something that you're seeing from the macro level that that is working? Well? Yeah, I think across basically all AI platforms, the, like, first iteration, the first draft of something, it's the speed to first draft. Yeah. So you know, because you can sit down and just put a prompt in and the prompt can be kind of shitty, but it'll just get something going. And sometimes for a lot of us, especially actually, I think the more expertise you have in a subject matter, the more Failure to Launch is possibly there. It's not even a procrastination. It's like an overthinking thing. Like I know all of these details, but how do I pull them together? And I put it into this email? Well, and I sit there and I sit there and I mess around with them. No, I don't like that, you know, it's stilled, 1990s movies, crumpled paper and throw it in the waste. draft number five, you know, yes, it's like now just start. Because what's been thrown in our face is something we all inherently know. But we're only now really experiencing in real time, which is that knowledge isn't power. Especially not in the era of the Internet, we have access to an insane amount of knowledge. And with AI, like the speed at finding that doesn't say into knowledge put into action as power. So the people who win in this next year are the ones to take action and do the Fae follow through. Yeah. Great point how much anyone knows? Irrelevant? Irrelevant? How are you noticing with your 13 year old son in relation to the relevance of going to school, I have a 17 year old son and 11 year old daughter, and I'm watching the way that school is operating the way that when I went to school, and then just the simple fact that now they're interacting with AI and the internet, I guess it almost seems obsolete. And I take it back to I mean, I love studying. I love reading. I'm a huge fan of reading a huge fan of studying a huge fan of learning. So I'm not trying to say that kids don't need to go to school nowadays to learn we definitely need to learn so I'm not going there. But it's almost like obsolete to go to school because you know, like remember back in the old days, I mean, we had to like study and read the whole entire chapter in the book and then be ready for the test and hopefully memorize enough of that information. And now in the real world situation even like what you're doing in terms of coaching people if you have a question or We're gonna go straight online, and you're gonna ask it, you're gonna find the answer. So I'm just curious, um, what are you noticing witnessing just as a father and a parent, or a parent and and a business coach in relation to that? Yeah, let me tie these three components together, because I'll go back to your previous question as well as well in this. So the first thing I'm noticing is the potential of speed. Hence, the first drafting thing. Here's another really practical example, right? If you're using mind body online, that's probably the platform that still currently, as it stands today has the best total capability of reporting, if you know really how to use it. They're the ones that are catching up to it. But platforms that have not as good capability of reporting usually have the ability to export a report. And because of that CSV file you have, you can now upload that into AI. And you can do that times three or four different reports. And what would have taken a data analysts like two days of moving things around and blah, blah, blah, to like, come up with a report to cross reference through everything you can do in five minutes? Well, so yeah, what's interesting, right, like, now we can that critical mindset of how do we approach the business, we can take these things like the data is there, the data is the code knowledge, but you're not empowered unless you can use it, the use of it before, it was like the cost benefit of trying to figure it out wasn't there. But now because of this speed it is. So practically in the business, there's like things we can look at now. With a more critical eye and optimize over time, much easier than we could before. And that will, will become more of the consumer expectation that you're optimizing for them. When it comes to school, I see a similar thing where I find it really comical, there was like a big push for a little while, maybe a year ago, or even to like kind of you shouldn't want to be shouldn't be allowed in the classroom and that sort of stuff. And it was like, There's no way this is stopping, like, I'm the exact opposite, this is absolutely should be embraced immediately, because it's going to happen anyways. So I think the difference is, with my son that 13, like if he's smart, and he will try to use Gemini or try to use GPT to get the job done. So you can be finished and move on to the thing he really wants to do. So that to me is a problem. On the other hand, if he's enthralled in what it is he's doing, and he's using this tool to do research, and then to ask a question and understand it better. Like that is what learning is, so that he can, you know, consolidate the information down into the real core components of what needs to be understood on a deep level of real knowledge so that it can be applied in the real world rather than like memorizing a bunch of data points, right? Yes, then it could be really positive. And you said something to the effects taught or at least it picked this for me, it's like, for me, for my kids, I think about like, I really love learning now to if I was 13 when I've ever said like, I love learning. Now, obviously, like I love hockey, you know? Yeah. So I think anything for my kids that can keep them engaged, and have them enthusiastic about learning in itself. Like that's the thing I want for them. Yeah. Yes. Good point. Yeah. See that? 100%? Yeah, yeah. And then on the on the business side of things, into this branch is a little over to marketing, we talked about learning in my mind, too. I would say that marketing is an exercise of memorization. If I can't remember you, I can't do business with you. So to build your brand, the goal is the appropriate person has to like hold you in their brain. And how does that happen? Novelty. Something has to be new and get us excited. outside of the box, it's it's so different than I have to tell someone else about it right. And then repetition, I got to see it. See it again, see from a new angle, obviously from this angle, if you hear it again and again and again. And again. So true. So when we talk about learning, I think the other element with any of this business kids whatever is the ability to look at the same subject from this side and then look at it from this side, look at it from this side and to do that more like thorough analysis and look at something so that we get all the different novel perspectives in a repetitious way. And the speed at which that can happen now. Good, exponentially fast. Asking for the appointment. It's amazing too, because like, how long have we even had chat GBT in our sphere? Is it been a year now? Okay. Has it been a? Has it even been a year? It's probably been about a year. I don't know the date. I don't remember when it was released? I don't even know if it's been a whole year. Yeah. I think GPT three years, maybe almost two years now, five years. All right. No, no, that might not that might not be even true. Might be less than that. That to your point, though, Todd, you're right. It's like, we don't understand like the we've already passed this moment in time. But I think that it hasn't like hit the public yet. It'll probably be like your kids and my kids age that really understand this inherently. The speed at which technology progresses, is faster than the human brain and is wired to learn. Like we can't, it's not even possible to stay up on top of it. And that's a really interesting place to be. So true. And, and with AI, the growth curve is not linear. It's very exponential, right? So it's like GPT, three to 3.5 3.5 to four, we're not talking like it's twice as good. It's four times as good, which means the next one is 16 times better. And the next one after that is 32. So what is that in three? We're not talking about 20 years from now. We're talking about three years from now, five years from now, what does that look like? It's not the same thing. I hear, it's impossible for us to even really wrap the mind around, isn't it? Like I was watching this show on Netflix about the my, my my wife will joke with me right now. It's about the Neandertals. And she's like, Why do you have to say Neandertals? It's Neanderthal. And I'm like, well, the whole show said Neandertal. So I'm going to the fourth the show. So anyway, but like the Neanderthals, or, you know, we have in our DNA, Neanderthal DNA, and there was like a span of about 300,000 years where Neanderthals were walking around on planet earth, then there was about a 40,000 year gap where they weren't and homosapiens was on the rise. And I mean, when I try to wrap my head around that think, like, you and I, and a version of you and I, and if we think about a version of say, chat of like, of like AI, this, this version of AI is just coming out within two years, it's already transformed everything and the speed with which we can work and the way with which we're working in the way with we're you know, but it took 300,000 of Neandertal history, and then a huge gap of 40,000 years before we even have present understanding of like, say five or 6000 years ago in relation to the origins of religion in history, you know? Yeah, humanity, so it's hard to even comprehend. It's like we're living in this the world is absolutely incredible. And I think I love the way that I love the way you're framing everything. It's very, I liked the way you see the world. I appreciate the way you're framing this because it's embracing it. Let's we have to embrace it. We have no choice but to embrace it at this point. But can we even comprehend what's going on? It's unbelievable. But thank you for staying on top of it. And for gearing us along here. Thank you for saying yeah, I mean, you make me Oh, it was gonna make me think of you make me think of the you guys right? Like, I think it Sadhguru got asked once. Because debatably 2012 That That event was movement out of Cali yoga into Dr. Yoga, and someone asked like, are we Is that what happened? And he says, If I tell you are in Dr. You That Tomorrow? Do you wake up and do anything different? And they're like, Well, no, he's like, so who cares? Right, because it really changed an interesting question. But yeah, but like we're talking about this, like hundreds of 1000s of years enormous cycle. And and I guess the idea being like, we can't contemplate if you simplify it tied into Egyptian or mind philosophy, that's, that's parallel to this. Like, if we're in the Bronze Age, now, out of the Iron Age, we're gonna move into the Silver Age, like, even the Silver Age, the next epoch that will move through like, our brains can't even fathom what that is what that looks like. So it's not even that we need to kind of worry about it, but rather be in the moment of now and worry about what can we control, tying together with business education, all this stuff. You don't have to understand exactly how something works to be able to utilize the tool. I don't need to know exactly the inner workings of how my iPhone works to use my iPhone, correct, like to positively enhance my life. So AI is a little bit like that. That being said, I do have to understand the larger perspective, that sort of critical thinking part of like, why would I use my phone. So if I could say like, Okay, on a business, I'm gonna buy this iPhone, it's got this camera, so that I can make these marketing videos, then I'm going to use it to then edit on the phone through this app, which I'm then going to upload to this place, social media where other people are going to see it, I still have to have this bigger perspective of how it fits into what I need in my life. So I think that's the part that we're getting to experience in business right now. But probably also in education. That's the, it's ripe for upset. So that'll be part of that, too. It's like, if you can, if you know, the specific detail, this calculation that whatever in business, like, who I don't know if that matters, yeah, the bigger perspective of this is a vehicle of change is going to create this impact in the world. The reciprocity is what's gonna build this lifestyle for me. And I need to look at it like, what's the path towards that if something's blocking it? Is it that my philosophy of approach, like, my strategy is wrong? Is that my strategies? Right? I just need more. Is it that this is a little tweak? Is it that it's an implementation thing? Like it's just is the owner yards of that bigger perspective? And then you're pulling in any of these tools, any of this to figure it all out? So it's gonna make us I think, ultimately, AISI? Like, the moment that we're in to me, it's exciting because it feels very yogic. Yeah, feels like we're in a big yoga class. And it's like, yeah, your posture is but that doesn't mean you're not gonna feel when you get in it. Are you gonna love it today or hate it? Or like, it was practice long enough can tell you. Posture was your favorite when he started, you might have hated for a whole year. And another point, and vice versa was something else. Good point. Good point. And I love it. I think going back to what you brought up, initially, that the yoga studio potentially, is a place where this evolutionary process really can, can accelerate. And I, I think, see, I'll see if you agree with me or not, but because of the entrepreneur, married with the blended and married with the yogi, the yogic mind, and the entrepreneurial mind creates a space where things can move faster. I do think that personally because I'm able to interact with all these different new platforms and teach in person in my studio, but also be here with you now you're I don't know where you are. Where are you actually, in the world? I'm in Mexico. Yeah, yeah. It's a go to school in Mexico here, so yeah. Awesome. Inside. Lita. I did see that on your website. You inside Lita? Yeah, we live in Sayulita. My son goes to school in Florida. High School in town here. Very cool, as well. So and the fact that we even got this far in the conversation that is almost obsolete on some level, right? Like we're, we're in a, an alternate universe where, you know, we're now conversing and and I guess, the point being that, I think that yoga studio and Yoga people are embracing these technologies and and now making it known so that people are like, okay, let's actually do this, let's, let's blend these incredible tools with yoga. So I do agree with you, I feel like we're in a very yogic age, in relation to the speed, our brain is moving at the speed of technology, where now that it is moving faster than our brains, we do have to just chill out and relax right now and just watch, but be active and keep our businesses running. But I don't know, I hear you, man. It's incredible. I'm very excited about what the future holds, to be honest. I am too, and I think it's easy. And I personally have gone through the waves of this too. Like, it's easy amidst all of the insanity in the world to because it is there to look at things from a very dystopian viewpoint. But you know, my most measurable data points, like we're doing pretty good. And we're moving in the right direction. And, you know, speaking of the kids, like, I don't even know, I don't know what work looks like, I don't know what things that look like for them in 20 years. It's actually I think, I'm not 100% sure that my parents would have said exactly the same thing. Yeah, like I think they could have, they could have called like, I'm doing some things different than they would have thought of, there's definitely tech out of this different but they would have still like I'm not working that. I guess I work online. So that's the major change from like my father, or my grandfather. Great. Like I think I can't even predict? Yeah, what it looks like, for my son? So maybe in the ways I think the the utopian part of it is is like, I think I almost you almost have to look at it that way like, yeah, to keep our to keep our mental health in a positive place, right? Because if we mental health is huge, and if we don't actively choose how to see the world, it will pull us down the dystopian path, for sure. Or it can. Yeah. And I tend to think like what a statement that you made earlier regarding the benefit, one of the benefits of COVID was that we then when we were not allowed to be in studio, it gave us a greater appreciation for when we were able to return, we took it for granted, we realized we weren't able, and then we came back to it. And I've been thinking lately in relation to like, I'll use AI to write some stuff. And then I'll also consciously journal so that I do like an organic writing. And I know the way food is gone, is that like now we pay a little more for organic produce, and I have a feeling that the AI is gonna get so intense that we're going to want to be a little more back to the human element. So we'll have maybe labels, we'll have labels on our content. This was this is an artificially generated content. This is organic content. And I don't know that there'll be a way to disprove or prove it. However, I just think the process of currently now knowing that I can go in on a I have my prompts written everything done for me and blah, I to hand write in a journal, my feelings, thoughts and what I gained out of today. i There's a lot of value in that. So I'm a fan of implementing both and still going analog still taking out a pen, I still have a record player, I still get in the ocean and serve like I want to be in the environment and using analog stuff. But I think we can do both. Yeah, I think it's going to be possible. And the hope is that the AI element will just enhance our organic experience organic writing organic ghee being in the ocean, digging our hands in the soil hanging out with our kids. I do. That's my hope anyway, that's, yeah, no, I see it, I resonate with what you're saying, Todd, I look at it like a lot of the brass tacks, customer service stuff, the stuff that like actually, as a studio owner as the example. Or if you're a solo yoga entrepreneur out there, like teacher trying to do the corporate thing or whatever, like, it's the stuff that will hit you in the face, you do have to offer customer service, you do have to have sort of an HR relationship with your employees, etc. Those are the things that wear you down over time. So where some of this tech comes in is it simplifies the like, automated, easy response, but still gives the customer side of it. Like, it's imagine I can go into your website, and I can just like have a conversation with boat you your website to get the information I need. And you're not spending time doing that. And you can curate that. And it can improve itself over time based off of its interactions. So now you're you're not handling any of that, which means like, what are you going to do? Well, you can do more somewhere else in the business. But then the big detail I think is then when I come into the studio, and you're there face to face, that's where you've like honed your craft? Yes, we do. We do sales trainings, even like physically go to studios and do sales training, it's because we can do them online, we have online courses for it, we can train an owner how to train their team on it. This is just more powerful for their face to face. And that's one of the things that we talked about is like there, there's no email that I can write or an AI at this point, and there is no text message that I can send you, including an AI that will ever be more powerful than you and I face to face within a certain proximity having a conversation, in my opinion, agreed. Even if the wording is more perfect, and it's just it's the nature of like the energetic element of it. Yes. And we talked about it from like a communication human relation standpoint. You know, 55% of your communication is body language 38% tone, only 7% of the words the words can be perfect, but it means a lot if I'm if I'm there facing you, and I'm engaging you and there's also these like unwritten things that we know it could be really specific example. Traveling we experienced this and we've tested it a few times sort of for quote fun, a walk into a yoga studio and not say anything to walk in like I'm brand new, I have not pre registered or whatever. I just stand in the Right lobbyists see how long it takes until someone engages me. And then what happens next? Like, what am I offered? How am I showing around? How am I greeted? Like who? Like, what's that process? Yes. And in the world, unfortunately, there's like a pretty wide array of what you could get like you could stand in a lobby for a long time studios. Meanwhile, the person teaching the class and the front desk are having really in depth engaging conversations with a long term member. Because they know that person, yeah, versus a well trained studio, who's really in service of the person coming in goes, Oh, I know that the priority would be someone who's brand new. Because the person who comes here five days a week, I don't talk to them as much today, they're gonna be okay, and come back tomorrow. But I can only make a first impression once. And then that they're actively looking like, Oh, is it your first time and right away, they're on it. And then I feel seen, it doesn't matter even what you say, like just that feeling element of it. You can't fake that. So I think that, that like honing that craft, like the real like human stuff, that's what's left. And that's where we that's what's gonna be a big differentiator in business. But I think just also in life, it's gonna be like a cool place to migrate from. I agree. Josh, have one more question for y'all and respectful of your time. Thank you so much for taking time out of your day. And, and I love this opportunity. Have you ever seen that show Bar Rescue? Yeah. Would you ever think about doing a show like that be so cool if you took your skills, and I would went into a studio, have a production team filmed that? Because one thing I love about Bar Rescue is I mean, I love watching that transformation, where he just comes in, he's so honest and real. And he does exactly what you're doing. You guys are doing the same thing. You're looking and you're seeing right away. I love how you said I can walk in and how many seconds did it take for you to actually make eye contact with me? Right? I'm just standing in the lobby like, and making you feel welcome. Right away the moment or even opening the door for you like being there. Right that you know, I mean, like that's huge. Enormous. So it'd be so cool. If you had a TV show that demonstrated to us yoga studio owners, like a full transformation? I don't know, I know, it's a big project. But if you need some ideas of know as you go, that'd be awesome. To watch you do? I would I would. I'm 100% for it. We actually this concept we've talked about a lot throughout the years, we have made a couple little episodes. No way. Haven't you had to use whatever. So you can find them find them on their YouTube channel. Oh, cool. You know, they're just like me, and like my friend Selena with one camera, you know? Pretty simple. But yeah. I'll tell it. Here's the like, the thing I've learned about it, actually. Because I was I was really stuck on it to the point I'm like, maybe we just really invest in going that route for a while. Because, you know, the stories are the thing that like we can live through vicariously and learn a lot from the problem is most of you know, reality TV needs controversy. So you're like, not just looking for, like, how do I help the studio we're looking for, like, how do we have a conflict between me and the person? And how to how does like the camera crew, like get the staff like, you know, there's a lot of behind the scenes kind of shenanigans, it's really in my mind not. So that's, that was that's been a funny, funny element. That said, I do feel like there's an opportunity for something like that. It just looks it would be its own thing. It would be like, Okay, we've seen the Bar Rescue game or whatever. We've seen the profit, we've seen these things like that, like, what's, what's the yoga version of that? So I haven't quite figured that out yet. I'm open to any suggestions, but I feel like those stories are ones to be told for sure. That's a good point. Oh, cool, man, I learned so much. If people are struggling in their business, they can reach out to you and you have a whole team, yourself included, that can help coach me can help coach anybody that's aiming to make this work and then thrive. Yeah, yeah, we work with yoga entrepreneurs, we define that as you like, are legitimately running a business. So if you're just a teacher, and you're like, hey, I want to like do my thing and teach a corporate class or something. There's a lot of resources for you out there. That's that's not our specialty. But beyond a brick and mortar yoga studio, or multiple for that matter, where you're doing like a bigger online thing and this is a like a legitimate you're investing your blood sweat, tears time money into this thing. Like that's who we are. That's what all of my coaches as well. They've all made Delivering off of this as well and improving it. And we're here to help. Cool, man, it feels good. It feels good to know that there is help. Um, there's times when you're running a business where you feel helpless and alone. So, you know, knowing that you've set your business up now to actually facilitate these situations. It's great now and we need all of the we all have to come together. I think totally. Yeah. Yeah. Cool. I'll echo that one comment, Todd, that just the yoga world has had this weird. I said earlier, like incestuous ness to it. Almost a little bit of a negative impact, because it's not based off of like, anything else. And then at the same time, there's this weird tension of like, despite the copying each other and wanting to know what each other doing, like people are not as sharing. Like, there's a scarcity mindset. And I feel like that's one of the things that I'm starting to see change. There's still some old guard that don't let go of it. But like, if you're gonna go good business, like you're not you're not competing against other yoga businesses, not really, you're only competing against yourself. And what you're really competing against is everything else that takes someone's attention. So yeah, I mean, part of part of our our mission is, you know, primarily, it's good the business functioning properly, make you more money gave you that ethically affluent lifestyle, but it's also you're isolated at the top. How do we get, you know, yoga entrepreneurs together having just down Earth conversations? Yeah. Yeah, because we're all we're all gonna but like the rising tide raises all ships. Yes. That's my fav. Man, thank you so much, Josh. I really appreciate this. I feel inspired. I one thing I love about podcasting and meeting other professionals is that I come out of it going, I just want to get back in there and start teaching and get my studio going good. I want to I want to open the door quicker next time. So I really appreciate what you're doing all the all that you're bringing to the table. Thank you so much, man. It's needed. Thanks for having me on. I really appreciate it. Thank you. Have a good one. Native yoga taught cast is produced by myself. The theme music is dreamed up by Bryce Allen. If you liked this show, let me know if there's room for improvement. I want to hear that too. We are curious to know what you think and what you want more of what I can improve. And if you have ideas for future guests or topics, please send us your thoughts to info at Native yoga center. You can find us at Native yoga center.com. And hey, if you did like this episode, share it with your friends, rate it and review and join us next time