Cathy Louise Broda - How Yoga Can Support Women During Pregnancy and Motherhood

Cathy Louise Broda is an experienced yoga teacher based in Honolulu, Hawaii. With over three decades of teaching history, Cathy has a wide range of expertise in working with families, children, and babies. She is the founder of Purple Yoga and is passionate about sharing her love for yoga with others. Cathy's teaching style is influenced by her background in Ashtanga Yoga and her commitment to creating a supportive and empowering environment for her students.

Visit Cathy on her website here: https://purpleyoga.com/
Follow her on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/purpleyogahawaii/
Watch the episode on YouTube here: https://youtu.be/Hqc9YxZmS7U

Key Takeaways:

• Cathy Louise Broda has over three decades of experience in teaching yoga and has a diverse background in working with families, children, and babies.
• Yoga can be a transformative practice that not only benefits the physical body but also supports mental and emotional well-being.
• Finding a supportive community and having a dedicated yoga practice can help individuals navigate challenging times and find balance in their lives.
• Cathy emphasizes the importance of listening to the body and practicing yoga in a way that feels authentic and empowering.

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Transcript

0:33

Welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast. So happy you are here. My goal with this channel is to bring inspirational speakers to the mic in the field of yoga, massage bodywork and beyond. Follow us @nativeyoga and check us out at www.nativeyogacenter.com All right, let's begin Welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast. I'm so happy that you're here. My name is Todd McLaughlin. And today my special guest is Cathy Louise Broda. Cathy is in Honolulu, Hawaii. And you can find her on her website, www.purpleyoga.com. I'll have the link in the description you can very easily click and follow. Also her Instagram handle you'll see there as well, you can click and follow. And on her Facebook page for purple yoga, and also her personal page, which I'll have a link there to is a pregnancy yoga album, which some of our students have allowed for her to share. So as you get a chance to listen to the many, many, many years like three decades plus years of teaching history that Cathy Louise has, she really spans the gamut in relation to working with families and working with children, working with babies. And just really sharing her love and passion for the yoga is such a pleasure to hear her stories and I feel so inspired right now. I can't wait for you to hear this conversation. Remember to check us out on our website nativeyogacenter.com and follow us at @nativeyoga on all the YouTube and Instagram or wherever it is you'd like to get content. All right, let's go ahead and get started. Thank you Cathy Louise. This really was fun. Let's begin! Today I have the pleasure and privilege of having Cathy Louise Broda here, Cathy Louise, thank you so much for joining me today. Thank you. Thank you for inviting me. I'm excited to be here. I'm excited to hear about your journey in the world of yoga and have some of our some of you are listening. But here I can see you. And if you want to watch on YouTube, you have surfboards in the background. And yeah, and those are not mine. They're not yours. And you live on Oahu in Hawaii, correct? Amazing, correct? Yeah. Where are the Wahoo Are you? We're in we live just outside of Honolulu. We're in kind of a neighborhood outside of Honolulu, about 12 miles. All of our teaching is in Honolulu in town. But we live up at about 1000 feet looking over Pearl Harbor. And then we can see all the way down to Waikiki and diamond heads. We have a really nice, beautiful, nice view of the ocean. How old are your children? My oldest is she'll be 21 in this year. And in September and then I have twins that are going to be turning 18 In April nice and do all of them serve or one or two of them serve. The older one does she with them and the oldest one Coco she does water polo. She plays water polo in college. And when she's home, she serves my one of the twins Leila. She does serve a lot. She learned how to surf during the pandemic because there's nothing else to do. And she's a swimmer. So the swim club, kind of got the kids together at that point in her life. The only thing we could do was get in the ocean. Yeah. So she started to surf and she now goes off. She goes off to the North Shore sometimes doesn't see the big waves. But does the small waves. Yeah, cool. Yeah. Amazing. Yeah, yeah. Right. And did you where did you grow up? I was born in Hawaii are born kind of in the house that we're living in. Ah, and then when I was two, we moved to Singapore. And between two and 17 We were between Singapore and Indonesia. Jakarta. So I went to the American School in Singapore. And then I ended up I graduated from the International School in Jakarta. So my first returned to the States was when I went to college, and I went to college in Connecticut. I moved to New York for about eight years. And then I moved to London for nine years, and then I moved to here. So I've lived most of my life outside of the states. Make sense now. Yeah, like we've been in Hawaii, for we moved here in 2001. I met my husband Glen in in London. And then we moved here, got married, set up the studio had kids, and that was 20 will be. Our purple Yoga will have been in business for 22 years this year. I think 22 told me man, congratulations. That is amazing. That's incredible. My wife and I have been here in our location will be 18 years this month. And so 22 That's a solid commitment, and still still feels very new sometimes. So that's great to hear. Yeah, always grow well, it's always it's kind of it wanes, and then it games and it's just always up and down. Yeah. So are you sad for the pandemic? So we're we survived the pandemic, I can say that. Yeah, that would have been challenging. In Hawaii, I heard there was some challenge, you know, the restrictions were real. And with travel, and it was really I would just, I listened to plenty of these interview with you. And she was talking about how they're close for your a year, over a year we were closed for. It was like 2425 weeks. Wow. And then they reopened. But they were like, you can have a quarter capacity, which for us was for students. So each morning, we had eight students the morning, and then they opened up to half. And I guess it was the size it was it was all about social distancing. So we could fit for people in our studio space, socially distance at the correct distance and everything. So yeah, we did that for oh my gosh, it was just too long. And we couldn't adjust. So myself and one of our other teachers, we basically sat on our hands in the corner giving verbal instructions in our master class, which was insane. And then eventually, everything, you know, started to open up. Yeah, I was just it was an expense. I know. I was just, I was just reminiscing with someone yesterday about the fact that remember what it felt like say three or four years ago when this was in his high and we it felt like this might be the rest of our lives. Like maybe this is going to be the catalyst for some sort of weird change that. And now we were just talking about like, oh, yeah, we could do a travel over here. And we could travel over there. And we weren't even considering the fact that that was so difficult just two or three years ago. What did you have a similar experience? Or did you have this? Yeah, we did. We we did with the master class. We did. I mean, I think we lost some people, because it was just hard to get into the studio there was that. And I think that people got used to it was interesting, I was talking to another woman that I am friends with in in Japan, she also has a small studio. And she was saying that it's like after the pandemic kind of finished, and we were able to come back in person. It was almost like that first initial, when I was able to adjust people in class, it we were so used to being so far away. And all of a sudden, I was like, touching people and adjusting them and it felt so close. And a lot of studios, I think a lot of students went on Zoom. So then it was like students trying to coax them back into coming into the studio was difficult. Yeah. Like convincing people that we used to do this, and we can do it again. So it's it's almost like we've had to re educate ourselves after the pandemic of like, how do we how do we go back into a space? How do we practice with each other? And, you know, I'm sure you remember that first couple of classes, or, you know, first few months of classes when somebody would sneeze or cough and it'd be like, a dog cough. And everybody now, it's interesting now, because when people are we've got the little bit of COVID things going on still do them? Like I mean, I know it's everywhere. But I'm just curious. Yeah. There's apprehension or fear. A little a little bit. I think people are just more cautious. Now, if people have a call. Or, you know, we've had a couple of bills that have the flu. So they still they'll say, I'll say I won't come in this week. It used to be I won't come in on testing. I'll test when I'm negative. I'll come in. So there was all that kind of gone. But I think just it's almost like just the respect of not wanting to get other people sick. Yeah. When people are coming back because they've had a cold, they will wear a mask for a couple a couple practices. And then the mask goes on, you're like, Okay, you're well. And I think as a teacher, I'm you know, we're, we've given the responsibility to each student, this thing you guys have to we each have to be responsible for our small Ashtanga community here in Honolulu. So I think we were quite proud of ourselves. We never had any outbreaks within the studio space, or, yeah, we didn't have any community spreads. So that was all you know, positive. Yeah, so it's just it's just, it's just re educating and I feel like we're, we're coming to the place now where I don't think about anymore and I don't think people think about it much anymore. unless somebody's like hacking into the core. You know, they run outside of like, you know, coffin to their towel outside the door it kind of big. So yes, yeah, that's still happening. I think it's just a throwback to, oh, how much Oh, where we were of sickness. You know, I love the opportunity to actually hear that from you. Because just to reminisce, like, you know, we probably don't want to remember but at the same time, it's, it's relieving to know we're at where we are now. And to Yeah, everybody around the entire world was, this wasn't just against one person or one group of people. It was like, right, everybody. Yeah, buddy. Yeah, yeah, we're still recovering in some sense. Like you said, like a PTSD, almost of like, Oh my God. Like, if I'm doing a massage, and I feel like I have to cough I'm like, Oh, no. Oh, no. What's gonna happen? Like, it's just, like, traumatizing, like, in a sense, like, I'm like coughing and I swear to God, I coughed into my shirt. It wasn't I had, I promise you, I promise you. And your elbow. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Well, that's cool. What is your daily? What do you do daily practice wise these days? Well, actually, let me back up. How long have you been practicing yoga? When did you start? So I started yoga in 1991. I think it was 91. Nice. Now I started teaching and dating anyone I started practicing in 89. So I graduated from college in 87. And I moved to New York. And I was I was just my boyfriend at the time was doing something and I didn't want to do it. He was doing side to side I walked into a yoga class. And that was, my first class was with barrel Bender, Birch, and her husband, Tom. And I just fell in love with it. I thought this is I loved it. So that was 89. And then she barrel started an apprenticeship program. And I, she just said, Oh, you're interested in learning more about yoga. So I didn't think that I was going to ever teach. That's not where I want. That's not what I wanted to do. So I did that. And then a couple years later, I ended up covering classes for her and then started my own classes, and then just kind of took off from there. So that I was 24 when I started. Cool. And and so I was working as a secretary in New York City. I was I was also trying to act. So I was auditioning here and there, and then eventually moved to London. What was that? How did you go about that? You just the learner. Yeah, my partner was English. And we were living in New York City. And then he wanted to move back to England. So I just followed him. And I was working. I worked at Laura Ashley for a while. And Stratford because he was he was an actor as well. So he worked at the RSC. And so I was working or actually teaching some yoga classes, some of the actors in the company and then we moved to London and then in London, is when I really started to do more teaching. And then I ended up meeting John Scott. And, and then, what was it 9098 99 He and Lucy we're moving to Penzance moving to Cornwall, they're leaving London. So Hamish Hendry. He came down from Scotland. I think it was in Scotland. He came down from Scotland. And he did the early morning session of Estonia over London. And I took over the second session. So the two of us were teaching it or studying over London. Wow. That must man amazing time. I'm thinking right? Because yoga. Yeah, just so boom man and pumping it. It was it was it was, you know, we were our classes were packed. And it was, you know, there was a lot of a lot of people practicing Ashtanga. And then a lot of there was this. There were little pockets in London of different studios. And it was like, everybody was just cycling through each other supporting each other's classes, I would go to one other class and South London, on the weekends, their teachers would come in during the week. So it was this real cross pollination of Ashtanga community, people practicing supporting each other. So that was really it was a it was a really, I missed that I miss. When I moved. We moved to Hawaii. I miss my friends the most from that time, because it was just a really fun group of people. It sounds like if you born in Hawaii, Singapore, and Jakarta, Indonesia, your you lived like an island style lifestyle for most of your childhood, although Jakarta from what I understand is a very busy city. So maybe it is yeah, and I remember even visiting Honolulu once and thinking I'm on an island like how could I be this big city and I'm on a Hawaiian island like, I just thought so I know that you It sounds like you already were accustomed to city life. But then, yeah, New York and London, some of the most vibrant cities in the world, we could say, did was that very easy for you to transition from all those different environments? Yeah, I think I think because Jakarta, particularly Jakarta was a big city growing up, very sprawling, and just the just the busyness of, you know, movement of what what was going on. And also growing up in the 70s, it was in Indonesia was a very, it was a very free time. So I was used to, you know, public transportation, local transportation. So moving to New York was not that hard. And then moving to London, and also, having lived in New York for a number of years, wasn't hard. Coming here was was interesting, because I've never, I've never really lived in Hawaii. So it just felt very Island and very Island. You're like stuck on an island. And like, I look out my window, and I see the ocean every single day. And then you go an hour that way. And there's the ocean an hour that way there. You're just it's just ocean all around. So you realize how small it is. But there's still a big city, there's still you know, the bustle of Honolulu. And there's still traffic, there's lots of traffic. Yeah, there is. But I'm, I'm happy. I'm, you know, I think after now having three kids, I'm very happy that we could have Glen and I could very easily probably stayed in London. I think having kids in London is would have been more challenging. And then coming here we have the support of my parents. Just have fun having family around. So it was a it was a good move that we're happy that we're here. We brought the kids up here. That's so cool. Have you ever succumb to rock fever? Or I'll you know what I mean? Like I remember, I lived on Maui for a year when I was 18 and 19. And, and people said, you'll get rock fever. And I'm like, come on. I'm in Hawaii. Are you kidding me? How could I ever tire this, like awesome waves and wind and everything. But I do know what you're talking about? Like if you had beef with somebody, you couldn't escape it in a way that no, no, like, it's so you got to really maintain your relationships. And I didn't have that type of situation, but also not being local, I found that the local ism was intense. And so I was not welcome in a lot of situations. So I found that and the challenge of just affording to live in Hawaii. Yeah, was like it is it kind of pushed me off, you know? And yeah, what do you what do you find being a yoga teacher living and working in Hawaii it's challenging because the because we're dealing with big city, like having a studio in the city was expensive. And you know, we're the house that the house that I'm in right now is my parents house. And that's how we were able to be here. So because we moved in my mom and dad moved to the Big Island. And so we are here we were able to then go and rent a space to have our studio space. It's it is it's the when people I think people have this idea that you know, Hawaii coming to Hawaii is very contest beautiful, and it is beautiful. But the cost of living is super high. super high. So I think as a as a yoga teacher, our life is quite simple. So that makes it easy. We you know and then our schedule we we set up our we set up our studio in order to be able to support our family in order to somebody was always going to be home. Somebody was always going to be able to either drop the kids off and pick them up. And we're in this place now this transition now we're the twins are gonna be graduating in May. And Glen and I Are we our house is quite big. My mom and dad's house is quite big. And we're kind of looking at each other, like what are we going to do now? We're just gonna be two of us and a cat maybe. So we're just like, what are we going to do? So it is it's a whole transition? And it is. I think the I've we've had a number of people who have like, contact us I'm moving to Hawaii, I want to be a yoga teacher. And you know, do you have any, you have any classes that I can serve? Or you know, that kind of, I'm sure you get those emails as well of people that are looking for work. And I'm always like, Oh, it's really too hard here. Just so hard. Are you sure? It's beautiful. But are you sure you want to move here? Because it can it's if you don't have if you don't have your support network of people who are like family for me, it was family. I don't know how people do it. Yeah. And all we do is yoga. You know, we just that's that's what we do. So that's how we make our living. So you do get people asking you that question like okay, well what other job do you do? And you're like, No, this is this is actually there was always that proviso of like this is it And I live in my mom and dad's house. You know, so it's like, it's because people wonder, like, how are you doing this? It's like, because of my parents. That's how we're able to do it. Yeah. You know, that's, that's how it's been possible. And then even like, when we opened up our studio, my dad was a general contractor. And he, you know, we did all of the, the breaking down, breaking down walls, putting in the floor, Glenn and I and my dad did all of that ourselves. So my dad would like set something up, he said, Hey, I want you guys to do this, this and this, and, you know, set up the floor. And we would start and he'd come in and kind of advise us. So we learned how to do. We learned how to set up a studio. I had the, my mom and dad had their own business. So they were a good model for me of like, okay, my mom and dad run a business, we're gonna run a business, this is how we did it. So it's, I had that kind of backup. My family to be able to do that, if we were, you know, if we were living in London, and we were doing this, it would be probably possible because the population is bigger there. So there's, there's more people doing yoga. That's the other thing in Honolulu, there are so many other things to do. You can surf, you can run, you can bike, hike, you know, paddle. There's all these other things that people do. And there's also a very big martial arts community. So people do a lot of other things. And yoga is just one of those things, you know, so it's whereas New York and London, I think there was just up more people wanting to find something. And that's something was yoga excellence. And you are an ashtanga yoga practitioner and teacher. Yes. Yeah. And you you learned did you learn traditional style Stanga from barrel Bender Burch? I did. She was doing at that point in, you know, late 80s. She was doing like what she called power yoga. Because she said that, I think it was she was saying that it's like saying ashtanga yoga was just like, kind of too strange sounding. So she started calling it power yoga studios in the heart and the soft Institute Yoga Institute. So we, I, I don't know if I formally knew I was doing Ashtanga until later. And then, also during that time, I started practicing couple years and I started practicing with David life and Sharon Gannon of jeevan mukti. And they were also a sangha teachers, and they were just beginning the creation of what Jeevan Mukti style was. So I would go to the do multi classes on the weekends and then in the backroom. David and Sharon would do my sister classes during the week, so sometimes I would go to their master classes. I was practicing with Beryl doing some jewelry, monkey style, but I think at that point, I didn't. It was just yoga. I didn't know what it was so cool or sad. It didn't have a name. And then, when did so I think when did you realize Ashtanga Yoga New York City? In New York City, I think the it was, it was in the early 90s batavi. Joyce came to came to was hosted by Jeevan Mukti by David and Sharon. And David was like, There's this guy. He's coming from India. He's like the he's like the original guy of astanga of the Mysore style, and you guys all need to come. So that's I think, when I started to do more Mysore practice with, with David, and then Toby Joyce came, and I met the dress and it was like 9293. And that was like, oh, that's what this is, you know. And yeah, you know, people I had heard people talking about going to my store, and I didn't know what that meant. I was like, people are going and doing this thing. So I met I met. Yeah, I met batavi Joyce in 9293. And I think it wasn't until I really I knew I was teaching Ashtanga. I guess I said I was teaching Ashtanga I don't really remember. And then it was when I moved to London when I had a friend named Roberta. And she was like, Oh, you gotta meet this guy named John. He is the he's the guy who did the drawings. So I had, I had a piece of paper that David from Jeevan Mukti had given us a John Scott's drawings. So I had that as like, oh, that's the guy John, who then John and Leno created the Ashtanga Yoga Book, the little first book that was kind of out. So I had that book and then I met John and then it was like, oh, and then people started talking about going to my I was I took my first trip to my store in it was like, 9095 9697, somewhere around there. Yeah. And I went to India. And I came back for I was in India for six leaks and I came back and somebody's like, Oh, do you go to my store? And I was like, what? My store? I didn't even know. I didn't know what my store was got it. And you're like you didn't go to my store is like, No, I went to. I just traveled around for six weeks. I ended up at the Shivananda ashram, cool. That was kind of my goal, because I knew about Shiva Nanda. Yeah. So that was my first trip to India. And then everybody was like, Well, the next time you go, you should go to my store. So I think it was a 99. I went to my store for the first time. Practice in the old it was the Lakshmi for Shahla, the old small Shahla. And then again, I went back. I think it was, we moved to Honolulu, and I went back to my store again. That would have been like, 2001 ish. Yeah, so somewhere in the 90s I kind of knew okay, I'm doing this style. Yeah. And I always taught I taught it as barrel taught me and I think when I learned it from David it was there was small differences but it was nothing major barrel kept it very close a clean or clear because she was the yoga teacher for the New York Road Runners club. So she didn't use a lot of Sanskrit I didn't learn the sensory accounting. So when I started studying with David and he would do the sensory accounting or say the say the, you know, the awesome names in Sanskrit, I have no idea what he was talking about. So at that point, then I started to, you know, learn more about the traditional, but I guess I could say that once I started studying with John, what I learned from barrel was what I studied with John, there was not he wasn't correcting me on anything. It was just practice. Yeah, I'm just trying to think what would have what would have what would barrel have called them or Chiasson English? I think she called it I think she called it just merici merici. See? Yeah. Yeah. And like, what is the tree was always isn't I heard that a camera? He is a sage. But then the wild guy, god of storms? Have you ever heard that? That there's a reference to okay, maybe I'm totally off the fence there. Yeah, I've researched that before I throw that one out there. Yeah, I just no more he was, he was, he was a wise guy. Guy. So be wise, you know? No. Schedule. You know, when we did with barrel it was like, you know, hold your toes, put your hands under your feet, Triangle Pose revolve triangle. It was all just the English words. And no, no Sanskrit counting. Yeah, so it's like, first time hearing. Maybe, maybe it was batavi. Joyce, when when he came to do a look at that hearing of like, oh, there's, you know, there's these words that go with the practice that are not English. So what was your association with the word and or concept guru? When you met batavi. Joyce, and what was your assessment at that time? Oh, when I first met him, yeah. of Hindi. Was it more just like, here's this nice man from India? Were you this reverent like, Can I touch your feet? And that was Yeah. So I, I remember. And I think I saw a Jeevan Mukti video somewhere with Sharon talking. And there was a teacher named Ruth. And I think she still teaches the dealing with the style. And Ruth was on this video, and I remembered her she was at the end of practice and really stood in a line. And she kind of shoved me in the line. She's like, Can I get in line? And I was like, What do I do? What what's Why do you have to get in line? And so she, she was in front of me. And she got down on our knees and touched his feet. And I could see everybody in front of me going down. I was just like, Okay, I don't know what the food just is just like, okay, don't be awkward. Just do it, and then just do it. So I remember kind of getting on my knees. I touched his feet. And I stood up and I was like, thank you very much. And I kind of walked away and I was like, Okay, that was really weird. That was just so bizarre. So, yeah, and I don't think I, I don't know, it was just like, it was just part of the experience. And he was there for like a week. So everybody did it during and I was like, by the end of the week, I was like, I got this no problem. And then I was like, oh guru Oh, yeah, you touch his feet, you're paying respects to the teacher and all that and you know, he was referred to as Guru Ji. So I understood that and, and then it was when I my first trip to my store. And I saw it was it was this space was tiny. There was a staircase going up that people would go up to the top floor to do closing sequence. So you would sit on the stairs waiting, peering through this window to wait your turn to go into the room. And as people were feeling Finishing, they would get their shoes and Guruji would come out and they would touch his feet and give him a hug or touch students. Thank you very much. So I started seeing that and I was like, do I do that? Am I comfortable with that? And then my idea was my first practice in the Salah. I was late, I was like, you come at like nine o'clock. So I was like one of the last people to be there. I was practicing. And he, he was like putting a yoga Mala on his wife's picture. He was fixing the clock, and I was just doing closing sequence. And I was just like, this is kind of cool. This was it was like, I was the only one in the room. And he was just kind of closing up. And so I think from that point, I was like, wow, this is just a really special experience. And I think from then on, it was like, Yeah, I can do this thing, because this is, uh, this is, uh, you know, he is the original person who was teaching and so I just paid my respects to that, you know, and did that. So that's cool. I love hearing Yeah, that's a great story. Yeah, always. I Yeah. You. And do you think on some level to that culturally, it's, it's not that big of a deal. Like for us? We shake hands? Or are given? And yeah, then we see that and we've maybe been taught you bow down to no one, you know, like, this sort of like, yeah, this sort of element like, Don't give your power away to anybody. And in the image of bowing and touching someone's feet, and then I'm guessing like you, you get to go to Japan often and I know there's a strong Yeah, cultural respect an element of respect to everyone that comes back from Japan. They tell me they have so much respect in Japan, like it's just palpable, like you just feel respect for elders respect for each other. And I just wonder, do you think that it's a nice way of offering respect without it being a submissive type of gesture? Yeah, I don't, I don't see it as submissive at all. I don't see it as me giving my power away. I see it just as an offering of like, Thank you, and this is the tradition of what people do. So I would do that. And so I'm my mom is Okinawan, some half Okinawan. So I think growing up, my mom is born and raised on Maui. But she has that kind of deputies. Okay, now, and I have that in me of just growing up that way. So of being respectful of the elders of you know, leaving the room as you would leave as you would want to arrive in it. So all of the just the etiquette, I grew up with that. Yeah. So for me, it wasn't it's just a it's just being respectful. Yeah. And, and, yeah, it was, I guess, because nobody said, Oh, you must do this. It was just I saw other people doing it. Try it out once. And then it was like, this is okay. And so I continue. Yeah, that's cool. What is what is your understanding of relationship to the idea concept or having a personal guru currently? That's, that's been the biggest challenge in moving here. Moving to Hawaii. So for 20 years, I haven't had one teacher. When I was living in London, I met Nancy Guillo. Golf. She was in London. I think her daughter went to school in London. So I happen to one of my England friends, London friends said, Oh, you need to come and say it was lady named Nancy. She's from Maui. And so I met Nancy in London. And I was like, Oh, wow, that's really cool. You're from I'm kind of from Hawaii. So when I moved here, I, I did go to study with Nancy. I can't say that she was ever my boss. And the teacher, John. And Beryl were more my awesome teachers. Nancy was more kind of mentor. And at the time that I met her in London. It was it was a really important time for me to meet a female teacher. And so she really helped me to kind of bolster empower me as a female teacher in London. So that was that was Nancy. And I've, you know, studied with Monju and David Swensen and, you know, but I haven't, like done anything major with other teachers other than John and barrel, and then third would be Nancy going and studying and her salah. And I think now, I still am taught when I'm practiced by John, particularly when I'm practicing John is always there. When I'm teaching, barrel is always there, because some of the things I say are what I first learned from her so that that I'll say the lineage it kind of comes from the very early days when I first started practicing. And then now in teaching, having Nancy's influence and monjas influence in in Hawaii and also David Swensen, we had another teacher named Yoko Fujiwara, and she was one of our most advanced practitioners. And she was also studied with Monju and David and Nancy. And so there was a point where she was learning the advanced a series and we had as a studio, we decided that we were going to teach the, like David William poster way. So we were teaching her that in conjunction with her getting information from mando and David and Nancy. So it was kind of like, there was this group of people who were helping Yoko to learn. And while she was learning she was teaching us. She was also so like, I was her teacher. She was my teacher. She was Glenn's teacher, Glendon was her it was like the three of us, Yoko. Glen and I all were teaching each other. That's cool. With the input from the outside people, and like, yoga would go to a workshop, go to Montessori, something I like to do, like, okay, so I learned how to do this, this and this. So this is the correct way. And then she comes sometimes you've come and say, Well, David Williams and Monday we're having an argument about how to do this pose. And so, but we've decided we're going to do it this way. So we kind of put together philosophy with sentence video, we kind of put together what is the advanced a practice. And so we've had, we have a couple students who are through advanced and advanced B. And it's through the help of the the kind of the collective group of learning. I have only ever gotten through, up to like Raj a couple of times, and I need all theories, because I don't have a backbend. And my yoga journey was interrupted by having three kids. So my body, I was just always felt like I was always healing my body. So it was really it's always been, it's been super fun to teach other people how to do this stuff, how to do the advanced things, you know, with with the help with other teachers as well. The other like I'll say the original, the original group of people who studied with batavi toys. That is a really amazing breakdown of how you've come to I feel like well, in relation to my question, you answered it perfectly, or in a really great way, because, you know, I'm curious about your relationship to the idea or having a single teacher. But it sounds to me like you have like a collective guru, or like a Yeah, yeah, collection of input from multiple sources that are all right, in conjunction with one another. So it's like, a consortium like you're, you're you're getting feedback, and then people are hashing this idea out and No, and I love that's a beautiful thing. I think there was, I think it might have been Yoko might have been another friend of mine that had gone to one of the consequences in California. And made the observation that in watching and being in like, the lecture sections, were all like, Manjhi, Nancy, David, David, and, you know, the group of people, Tim Miller, that they were, I think there was one point, Dina Ginsburg, so they were all on stage. And each person had their experience of what ashtanga yoga was. So Nancy was like, he put me in everything. He helped me to lift up, he helped me to jump back, he assisted me and everything. You know, other teachers had different experiences. I think David Swensen was is more kind of jovial with batavi. Joyce. So, in this friend of mine had said in seeing, say, five people on stage, you're seeing different sides of batavi, Joyce, different experiences. So that's why it's like there isn't. There isn't one particular way because we all take in the information and then we process that and we digest it and then we practice. So there are there, as I said earlier, that there are influences that barrel gave me in that John KB that are very, very solid, and inside me and strong, and those things still guide me in my own practice. There are things that barrel would, you know, I can think of a couple of things that maybe barrel said that John in particular, that don't work, because I have a different body shape. So I've had to figure out how to do say push offs and a mark just as a C and D, pervert departure konasana all the twist because I have a longer torso because I'm happy now. And so from my experience, I then share my information with you know, with my students. And my husband, Glen, he's he's tall, he's six foot, two ish, Caucasian. So he has longer limbs, longer torso. So between the two of us. I can teach all the Japanese, Asian people, he's good with the Caucasian people, I understand the Caucasian people, but and I'm jealous of them because they got long limbs, and I got you know, I don't have that. So it's just, it's this combination of, of practice and experience. And so it was something that parent Ed Said, as well that I really loved in your podcast, your interview with her was that we, after a time, sorry, I'm talking a lot. No, I want you to stop after a short time, say after 10 years of practicing. If you don't know what you're doing, or you don't have a clue as to what you can do, and how you can practice yourself, then I don't know that the teacher, your teacher has taught you enough to be self sufficient. So we have we have some students have been one student in particular, Lisa, she's been practicing with us since we first opened so 20, over 20 years. She's gone through a whole bunch of different things, she's 20 years older. And she a while ago, you know, had lots of stuff going on, and then she's rebuilding her practice. And there was a point where I was like, Oh, my God, you're never gonna do second series. Again, never gonna put your foot behind your head again. And she's slowly has been working through her practice. And sometimes she'll good enough Asana start second series, sometimes she'll go to Genesis Chausson, and start second series. Sometimes she'll do all primary and just a little bit. But she knows what her body needs. And me as a teacher, I'm guiding her to say, Okay, let's try this a little bit to see if we can get like a half an inch more on your waist in order to get that twist or whatever. But I'm not like teaching her you must do it this way. That's long gone. She's already got that information. So I think that the longer you practice, the more it's the student, especially in a Meister practice, it is the students responsibility to take the information that the teacher is giving, process that work it out, and then figure out how it works for you. And so like, I always have those few people in my head, my teachers in my head telling me, can you please do this do that? Those things have worked for me, the stuff that doesn't work for me, I've had to figure out on my own. And then now I'm saying, I would like you to do it this way, because this is my experience. Yeah. So. And if it doesn't work, then I have five other ways that we can do it. And one of those ways might stick or you might discover your own way, and then tell me what you're doing so that I can learn from you. So So then it's the collaboration, the student and the teacher, especially for longtime practitioners, yes, when you get a new student, it's, it's fun, because you kind of get the good. Sound doesn't sound like I'm not trying to put something down or hold them down. But you get to mold them into the way that you practice the way that you teach. Yeah, my husband and I kind of joke that we have a purple way, we have a purple way of practicing. And some there are some people when they come in from wherever around the world, and they'll visit. And they're, they're practicing a Tim Miller way. Or they're practicing a Tokyo Wait, you know, so we can see the different practices. And then so we're just saying, try, do step this way first, and then do this. So then we're just adding a little bit of purple in there, right? We're just adding a little bit of our style in there. And so that it does, it becomes a collaboration of many influences. And of course, I have my, my main influence is that I started at 24 I had three kids, I'm now you know, childbearing is done. I'm in menopause. I'm going to be 16 A couple years. And so that's my life experience of like, I can teach somebody at all these different stages appropriately. You know, so I'm not going to teach a 58 year old practice to a 24 year old 24 year old I'm gonna say you should be jumping back. Yeah, don't practice like me, you know? Like, yeah I'm gonna listen joy and joy. Your youth, right? Like, isn't that kind of like when you look back to when you were 24? You're like, Yeah, you had so much we have so much energy and you could just like if you did get injured, it was like a one day injury and the next day you're back in and recover so fast like a six week recovery for like a little tweak knee or whatever. Yeah, that's amazing categories of love. I love that you're talking. Thank you for talking. I love hearing the stories is every everything that you just shared with me? Is that why you decided to stick with a method such as ashtanga yoga as opposed to you and to Shiva, Nanda, and you have this other Indian yoga experience. So what is it that thing holds you back into strongest for so long? Well, I think that Istanbul was my first experience and I did Shiva Nanda just for a short time and I did it in London, because it was just like right around the corner from where I was living. And it was just cold you know, you do a Paul posing you lie down and they do another pose me to lie down and be like, Oh, it's just so cold. So and then I tried to anger yoga, and I was I'm more energetic I and so it was like you do a pose and you have to go get some props, and then come back and do another post. And that was just drove me insane. So I've always kind of come back to I actually don't think I've ever left Ashtanga. I've always just stuck with the Stanga. And then I've tried other things. Yeah. And for a short time, I was teaching vinyasa classes, because I like to, I also like to kind of break out and do other things. But in my own practice, it's mainly just Ashtanga. And then I think what has happened and what I've seen is that Ashtanga is very much supported my whole life. My my practice, kind of put my body back together after having a kid after having a first kid. I healed I had a miscarriage in between the first my first daughter had a miscarriage and I had a twin. So practice after the miscarriage was all about, okay, just come back in, come back into your center, heal your body. After the twins, my body was just devastated. I, you know, it was huge. And I, I was like, I'm never going to get anything back. And then over time, it all kind of came back. So for me, the practice has been a way to heal, and then going through perimenopause, all the craziness of hormones. The practice, again, supported me through that phase in my life. And then I think, having seen our older population, students who were, you know, in their 60s 70s, that, they, they, they get good stuff, they get good energy, they get good feeling. And they, you know, they're, they're staying in their power, they're staying strong, too. So, you know, being able to see that, that that's where I'm going and I want so that's where I want to keep doing this practice, because I can see that it's, it can support anybody, if you're doing it again, if you're doing it appropriately, if you're doing it for the right at the right pace at the right and that's what that's what the gurus for. That's what the teacher is for. That we are able to identify, you know, somebody where they're at, and then teach them appropriately. And it could be like somebody in their mid 40s is, you know, things are becoming more difficult. But then there's like a burst of energy. So like, if you've got that burst of energy, use it. Don't just stay just pay attention to where you are teaching the students to pay attention where they are, and practice appropriately. Practice. Well, you know? Yeah, yeah. No, I love it. Amazing. What um, I just recently read a book called untangled which is by Lisa demore. She's a psychologist, psycho psychologist who she is I think it's some The subtitle of the text is navigating raising teenage girls through the seven stages of maturation. So basically just like a wonderful, but I have a 10 year old daughter, so I figured let me get a little jump on this. Let me let me like, get a little bit of information and get ready for what it's gonna be like to raise a teenage daughter I have a 17 year old son and that's been amazing and, and women are just incredible. And just I'm trying to learn as much as I can. What I'm what type of advice can you lend the husbands or the men of the world that are with you know, we're in our 50s and, you know, what can we do to be a little more supportive of the menopause process? Menopause. Just hanging in there with the woman just hanging in there. I remember telling my husband that I understood why men, why couples got divorced in their 50s or late 40s 50s. I can see why because As what a woman's body mind goes through is so insane. And I think I'm learning more about it now. There's a whole menopause hormone replacement therapy movement, which didn't really exist hormone HRT. When I was going through, it was kind of like taboo, there was a lot of myths of like, oh, it's gonna be the cancer, and it's really bad for you. And you should just be do natural. And so I didn't ever really look into it now. And I kind of wish that I had known about it. Because for me, menopause was it was really, really challenging. Mentally, it was very, very challenging. But I remember telling my husband Glenn, I was like, hanging in there with me, because everything that I was being told by women who were in their 60s, like, like late 50s 60s was like, it's crazy. between, say, 45 to 55, it's completely insane. But once you go into menopause, it's very calm. And I didn't believe that women that told me that, because I was like, you don't know what you're talking about? Get really aggressive with them, because I was just in that heat, aggressive place. But they were telling the truth, it really is. Once you go into menopause, when to stop having menstrual cycles, it becomes way calmer. It's very hard to go through menopause when you have teenage kids because they're entering, entering, you know, fertility. And I was exiting fertility. So there was a lot of wood that's constant. It was high. Yeah, yeah. That's cool. I appreciate that. Yeah, I think, yeah, I think that the thing I would say, for me, even for you, as a dad of, you know, of a girl that it's listening, it's it's really listening, it's giving kids space, because they need, the closer you are to a child, the more they need to divorce you, which is classic, they need that separation, they need to find autonomy. And that I can say with our older daughter, she's 20 Now, and kind of 1920 years old, she came, it's like she came back, and was like, the appreciation was there, the love was there that I love you the hugs. But she didn't do so much push away the twins have and because they were also writing the pandemic, that they were right in the middle of all of that as they were going through puberty. So it was really challenging. It's giving them space. It's not, it's communicating, but not over communicating. It's just, it's just being there. It's like just being present, it's just being there really kind of sounds like a yoga practice. Like when you're getting a little older, and you're doing a Stanga and you're like, oh my god, this is like, I'm in so much pain, like, should I still be doing this? And so the fact that you're saying just listen and be present, listen, yeah, keep with it, don't give up. Like don't know what I'm thinking. But you know what I mean? Like, right. And it's like, trusting it's like, also Yeah, with even stronger with with parents. It's like trusting the process. It's just trusting. Yeah. And then also when it's difficult, practice childbearing teenagers, when it's difficult reaching out to other people who are in the same space as you. So you know, you're not alone. You know, it's one of the things that I've done, kind of very purposely last couple years of really talking with women getting together with other women who are around my age, or maybe a little bit younger, a little bit older. But just getting together and talking and being an unknowing that, sharing our information, sharing what's going on sharing how we're feeling, hormonally, physically, because there's so much physical stuff that changes when you go through perimenopause, menopause, and just having that having somebody around that can you can confide in, that will hold your, that will hold you trust to be able to share information with and I would say probably the same thing for dads as well. It's like, it's just being able to find somebody that you can confide in best friend, a brother, a dad, whatever it is, you know, because it's, we've seen it so many times, in other, you know, with other people with other people who have older kids. When when we look back at a couple of friends who had who had kids who were maybe 10 years older than ours, and the things that they were talking about, were like, Oh my God, that sounds terrible. And then when you're in it, you're like, Oh, God, this is you know, and then now we're on the other side of her like, okay, you know, it's just phases. Yeah. It feels like forever, but it's not. What about the you guys seem to be approaching the empty nest potential here? Are you both navigating that in a way where you're seeing optimism or you starting to mourn? Like, what are we going to do? When the house is quiet? And we've already taught all our yoga classes for today? Right? I think that I think our, our oldest daughter, Coco, she was she seems to be more worried about, are you guys gonna be okay? We're gonna be fine. Don't worry about it, you will be totally fine. We've been doing things we've been doing little things like we've been starting, we started cooking together more Glenn and I, we used to be like, I would make dinner, you know, I cook and then he would make dinner or, you know, I'd have three days, he would have three days, and we would get takeout for the seventh day, whatever, you know, we're doing more cooking together, we're involved. We're doing more of like, what do we want to eat? As opposed to? We got to make a meal for the family. And it's a family always have we always have family dinner every night. But it's much more like what do we want to do? And I think we're both looking forward to having time to sit having time to read a book. And then there's always going to be in the back of the, you know, there's because it happened with our first daughter, there's always a phone call, there's always like FaceTime. So there's your it's not like they're completely gone. And then really gone for like, three months, and then they come back for Christmas to go away, and then they're back. They're back for summer. Like they're completely gone. They're just gone for a short time. We've, you know, we've we've, um, we're planning some little trips, we're planning to do some we're talking about when the kids aren't here. We can maybe do a workshop, or we'll have time to do a workshop or, you know, just I Yeah, we talk a lot about it. Together, we have been talking a lot about it just thinking about what do we want to do? That's so cool. I know. I know. It's so interesting, isn't it? Like you said the phases and the stages you just when you get so entrenched, and you think this is never going to end all of a sudden it's over? And you're going? Yeah, with a kind of walk? I missed it. I liked it was exciting, right? Yeah. scheme of things that goes by pretty quickly. Yeah, it goes by pretty. What about your thoughts in relation to life? 360 And you obviously didn't have life 360 When you were a kid, and you somehow are a mature, well rounded individual, and our children, we're like, where are they? There? They are. Oh, my gosh, he's driving five miles an hour. The speed on that column up, dude, you're speeding slow down? No, I'm not. It's not even accurate. What are you talking about? Like, trust me that her dad drove with my life. 360 on it's exactly at the speed with my speedometer. You know, like that type of thing. Like, do you helicopter parent? Did you helicopter parent with the technology that way? Or did you just No, no, we very much didn't do very much. Didn't? We? Did we did? We did. Our kids didn't have like Instagram until they were like, I want to say in ninth grade. They were not happy with us at that point. Now they know why. Now, they're all like, if I have kids, I'm not gonna let them have Instagram till 10th grade. I wish you had said that to us when you were in ninth grade? We did. We didn't do No, we didn't do a lot of helicopter stuff. Maybe the ninth grade. They all got phones. And I had find my friend. It was more about I want you to know where I am. I'm not checking on you. That's cool. Yeah. So if I'm driving to school, and you're wondering where I am, just pick you up, look at your phone, and you'll see where I am. Or, or I'll tell my daughter when my kids she works at a restaurant. So I at eight o'clock, I'll see when she's leaving the restaurant so that I can have dinner ready when she walks in the door. So, but it was never about they did say oh, you're tracking us all the time. I'm gonna like actually, I'm not. I'm not. If you say you're going to be where you are, then that's where you're going to be. And if you're not there, and if you want to tell me then. But if something happens, just call me and I will come and get you. We live on an island, it's very easy to get anywhere and an hour and a half or so even if you're on the North Shore. It's not that far away. Yeah, and I think that's Nancy had said this about Vanessa, that she at one point was thinking of moving I think, to the mainland. And she said that when you live on Maui, as you've lived on Maui, there's there's only so many places you can go to Hana, you can go there, you know behind it, you can go down to Kihei there's nowhere else to go. Whereas if you live on the main line, you can get in the car, you can drive all the way to Vegas, and you just keep driving to New York. So I think the luxury of have the luxury of living on an island is that you know, where everything is relative to the close. Element? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Very cool. What about I read that you've held down the longest kids yoga training kids yoga, yeah, but what is Is that all about that's, that's the mom and baby mom and baby yoga. So I started, I started I learned pregnancy yoga when I was living in London with Linda net. And so she was my pregnancy yoga teacher. I just apprenticed with her. And she was, I would go to her class and watch her. And then when I moved here, I got pregnant with Coco and I decided, Okay, I'm going to start teaching pregnancy yoga. From that class, it the women of that first group were like, can you keep teaching us because we want to come in with our baby. So then I started a mom baby program. And the women in the pregnancy class don't really know it. I don't think I've ever said it. The women who practice are strong with us that come to my store class and then come to the pregnancy yoga class, they can see I'm basically teaching Ashtanga Yoga for pregnancy. But it's kind of backwards, we start sitting, we do a standing sequence, we go back to sitting and then we lie down. So but the standing sequence that we do is pretty much Triangle Pose, partial canasta Anna Prosser, Rita's, but it's all variations of it's just a really nice. It's a nice standing postures for pregnancy is really nice for women to keep strong, stay strong, you eliminated a mom and baby class part. But eliminating the twisting poses, you said triangle and side angle, you didn't say triangle. So you kind of do twist, we do do twist. Um, that's something that I know you're not supposed to do twist when you're pregnant in Ashtanga but twisting for me, it's when you're, when you're twisting, not pregnant, you're twisting from your navel up. When you're twisting, when you're pregnant, you're twisting from your crown of your head down. And twisting for me was one of the most amazing things when when I was pregnant with my first daughter. But it's not. It's all it's all about. Why so amazing. Well, the chest when you're pregnant, your chest gets really heavy, and your belly gets really heavy. So all of the front of you get super, super tight or heavy. So your body basically goes into kind of the sea curve, and it just gets really really rounded and all between the shoulder blades gets so tight. So anything back bendy or remotely twisty feels really, really good. Yeah. So the twists in the twists in that I teach the astanga women and then in the pregnancy class, it's all to do with ribcage up to try and move between the shoulder blades. It's not the it's not trying to manipulate the belly at all. And you kind of like when you do a twist, you let your hips do whatever you want. They they're not You're not trying to keep them square, one hips going to drop down, I really don't care about that I'm really just focusing on what's happening with the ribcage up to up to the crown of your head, particularly across the center of the chest across the shoulder. And then that feeds into the mom and baby claps because then you're breastfeeding or bottle feeding and you're carrying a baby. And it's all about this. It's all really that rounded spine with the head falling forward. So we do a lot of we do a lot of stuff with the babies. But it's all about that opening, opening chest opening heart. Creating, going back trying to find your core strength. Yeah, so and I think the mom and baby class is super fun because I'm, again, like I was saying I'm not I'm not a great, I wouldn't be a great Shivananda practitioner because I'm too, too high strung probably. So the I've seen Mom and baby like videos, and I understand everybody's always like, why don't you do a video and I'm like, it's just way too hard. Because the class that I'm teaching, it's so dynamic. We're moving the babies around a lot. And for me, it's all about safety. Because I've seen some classes where you can like hold the baby, and hum to the baby, and then bring them over here and I'm like, oh my god, it's like, I just want to I just want to move. So we basically move with the babies for about 35 to 40 minutes. And it's it's for me, the class is really about empowering women to know that you can move a baby front to back up, down, and they're only going to get stronger. And I feel like I I've said this so much so many times over the years that we have to build our confidence in being able to move our body with our babies. So then your baby has that confidence. And then they grow up in their bodies and they're confident in their bodies. And we need strong children to take the world to a better place. Yeah, so that's it's all about, it's all about empowering the woman, the baby. And it's interesting because a lot of women, their babies ended up crawling quite early, between like eight, six to eight months, babies will already start to kind of switch and move and I think it's because we do so much with them. And I'm always like do this at home. Do The you know, do make it a part of your routine. And then the last thing with the pregnancy and the mom, babies, again, it's very isolating when you're pregnant when you're when you just have a new baby, especially if you're a first time mom feels very isolating. So I want to a lot of the groups, they ended up kind of becoming friends with each other. So you've got this kind of immediate group of friends who are doing the exact same thing. Babies are about the same age. And then they carry on, you know, I've had a number of women who were like, Yeah, I've friends with because of the mom baby class. So I think that's just really cool. Oh, my gosh, I love that have. Babies are so cool. They're so cool. Give you an opportunity to actually hang out with a bunch of babies. Right? So like, oh my god, I love I love being pregnant. Pregnancy for me was was amazing. Even with the twins, it was really, really hard. But I really enjoyed pregnancy. I labor was amazing. It was like super hard. But I I discovered I am have a very high pain threshold. And so it was just like roaring Cathy Louise was amazing. So and I love babies. They're just so amazing. They're amazing creatures. Once they toggle, I'm like, you're good. It's good. What little kids. I'm not good teaching little kids. I'm okay with my kids. But I have one friend who was here. She She has three children. I knew her when she was pregnant. I knew her babies a little bit. I don't know her kids at all now. And we've been out to dinner a couple of times. And I'm like, they have no idea who I am. I don't know what they are, who they are, what they're like. So I'm just good for this like, beginning of life section. I've just noticed that I'm like, Yeah, I'm really good with babies. But I'm not good with toddlers. I don't have the patience for it toggling is good to know our strengths. And I liked the way you were kind of between the way you and Glenn work together in relation to understanding different anatomical setups and the way you guys work together. So you're like, Look, I'll hold down this. And then when it gets to the toddler phase, you're gonna have to go elsewhere. Yeah, yeah. Because it's like, yeah, yeah. Have you had? Have you had anybody that you've worked with, say 22 or 20 years ago that has had children that has now had children? Have you had any third generational? No. Yeah. Just curious. Because you know, when you've been you've been doing this for so long, you've been teaching 30 plus years, you've been holding down the studio 20 plus years. I just thought perhaps you'd have this like, triple generation element coming through, but I'm sure I have my daughter Coco started practicing with me when she's here. Yeah. And that's really cool. That's cool. She, we never, we never made the kids do yoga, because they were swimmers. My daughter Miley does aerial acrobatics. So we never kind of said, Oh, you got to come do yoga with us. We take the same approach. Yeah. Or we're weird enough. I'm like, I'm already a weird parent. I don't need to say no, you gotta come to yoga with me. I mean, that's just the way to, like, just do your thing. So when like, Coco told me, she's like, Mom, can I come to yoga with you? And I'm like, sure it inside. I'm like, oh my god, she wants to Yoga with you so happy. And you know, I'm introducing the other cocoa. It was so proud. You know, it's kind of amazing back then. So that was just really nice. That was really nice that she wanted to come and she you know, she goes, Yeah, I do some yoga at night. I do stretching and I you know, and then she goes, she teaches the, her coach at school knew that Glen and I were yoga teachers. So couple was like, by default, he was like, well, you're going to teach the yoga class to the team. And she's like, okay, so she would call me up like, Mom, what do I do? And I'm going to do the sequence. And so we would go through and, you know, she's worked out a sequence that teaches her water polo team, shoulder stretching and stuff. So it kind of has come around but in terms of people who have had kids who have come to class No, we haven't had or you know, haven't had third second generation third generation. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. It's gotta be common. I'm sure you guys gonna be so kick in another 30 years doing this right. There's a good chance. Yeah, yeah, we're gonna Yeah, we it's all of our dreams of like, yeah, we'll go and travel. I mean, we've got Miley Lila will be in school, you know, they're going off to college in the fall. And then Coco will be a senior. So we've got one year where they're all gonna be in school and then and then it's gonna be you know, we're gonna keep going until the twins are out of college. And then I just, I don't I love what I do. So here yeah, that's Yeah. Kathy Louise. What? What a pleasure. You are really fun to talk to. I you're just really relaxed and natural. It's been so informative. I learned a lot. I have pregnant students that come in i feel like just the way you related the twisting from the bottom to the top top down. That was really insightful for me. I can't wait to share that information. I yeah, I just really enjoyed this. Thank you so much for taking your time out of your day and I can't wait to share this. Thank you for needy for introducing. thank you Penny. Yeah. Amazing. And thanks for getting you know, for for connecting with me. I really appreciate Kathy's Is there anything that you want to close with? Is there any prayer dream wish final farewell. We can talk again in the future. Yeah, um, so yeah. Yeah, yeah. Oh, I don't I don't know. I don't know. I mean, it's kind of sound so schoolmarm ish, like practice appropriately. But really, it's like finding when you're practicing. That something we haven't talked about. But there's so many times when people feel like they're doing the wrong thing, or they can't do something. And then a modification beat is like, Oh, if I do a modification, that's bad, I'm not worthy of this pose. And my whole thing is like, you have to practice to practice has to be sustainable. If you're trying to do something that somebody else is saying you should do or something you did, 10 years ago, it's not sustainable. And each phase each year, each year that we get older, you have to adjust the practice a little bit in order for it to then be able to sustain for another year, or you have an injury or you have a kid or something happens. So it's like finding the way to practice that is sustainable and joyful. You know, that it's, it's, it's serious, but it's not like heavy, serious, you know, and our master class we sometimes breakout whenever, whenever anybody like stands up for jobs back for the first time. It's ever like, Yeah, who's rupt? Because everybody's like, come on, you can do it. So finding the joy of practice as well, because it's, it's, it's already especially a strong it's, it's already a very strong practice. If you add in this level of seriousness, that just becomes so heavy. It's like, why are you doing it? If you're not finding joy, if you're not finding some some happy at the end of it? You know, so practicing be happy. I think I'm gonna have to make that the title of this episode practicing. Okay, yeah. sage wisdom. Yes. Thank you, Kathleen. Katherine. All right. Well, thank you. So great. I will see you soon. Okay, see you soon. Native yoga taught cast is produced by myself. The theme music is dreamed up by Bryce Allen. If you liked this show, let me know. If there's room for improvement. I want to hear that too. We are curious to know what you think and what you want more of what I can improve. And if you have ideas for future guests or topics, please send us your thoughts to info at Native yoga center. You can find us at Native yoga center.com. And hey, if you did like this episode, share it with your friends, rate it and review and join us next time