Jordan Lydia Verla - Healthy Competition: From Depression to Triumph

In this thought-provoking episode, Todd engages with yoga teacher and champion Jordan Lydia Verla, uncovering her journey from beginnings in Utah to her transformational expeditions in Seattle and beyond. This conversation shares Jordan's story, exploring not only her personal adventures but also her deep connection to yoga's physical and spiritual aspects.

Visit Jordan on her website: https://www.jordanlydia.com/
Follow her on IG: https://www.instagram.com/jordanlydia_yogini/
Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@JordanLydia

Key Takeaways:

• Jordan's yoga journey is deeply intertwined with her personal growth and overcoming challenges, including moving cities and dealing with anxiety and depression.
• The 84 Classic Asana series plays a significant role in Jordan's yogic and teaching life, demonstrating the balance of strength and vulnerability in practice.
• Jordan shares a refreshing perspective on the yoga competition, addressing the human element of competitiveness and its natural occurrence in growth and self-improvement.

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Transcript

0:33

Welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast. So happy you are here. My goal with this channel is to bring inspirational speakers to the mic in the field of yoga, massage bodywork and beyond. Follow us @nativeyoga, and check us out at nativeyogacenter.com. All right, let's begin. Hello, and welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast. I'm so happy that you're here. Thank you so much for supporting me all these years, I'm excited to announce that on March 27, of 2024 is our four year anniversary of the show. And so thank you, listener, for taking the time to listen, share and give me feedback. And it's just been amazing. And I want to thank all the incredible guests that have made appearance on the show for offering your time selflessly to share your journey in yoga, I believe it truly does help. It's been an incredible help and inspiration to me personally. And on that note, I'm really excited to announce this week's special guest. Her name is Jordan Lydia Verla. And Jordan, you can find her on her website, which is jordanlydiatarot.com. You can find her on Instagram, which is at jordanlydia_yogini. She also has a YouTube channel. She's offering a yoga retreat in Joshua Tree up coming up in the fall. And she's one of the more senior or focused and dedicated yoga teachers in the Seattle, Washington area that that teaches the 84 classic asanas and the Bishnu Ghosh lineage. She's extremely talented. She has been involved in yoga for a long time. And she also got involved in yoga competitions, which took her all the way to India to the World Championships. And she has a lot to share and a lot to say in a very sweet nature. And thank you, Jordan, so much for joining me. And I'm so excited for you to have a chance to now listen to this incredible conversation that I got to share with Jordan. All right, let's begin. I'm so happy to have Jordan Lydia Verla here today. Jordan, thank you so much for joining me on the show. My pleasure. My pleasure. I'm really excited. Oh, yes, of course. I'm excited. I heard about you because a student came in to take class from Seattle. And I'd asked them who in Seattle do you practice with and think is will be interesting. And he mentioned you. And so I'm so happy to get chance to talk to an interesting yogi! Yeah, he's a great student as well. And um, yeah, so I just actually recently moved back to Seattle. I was away for two years, kind of on my own little epic adventure, but had my own kind of Homecoming. Back to Seattle after going on a big adventure for myself. And yeah, so it's been nice to be home again. Nice. Well, I can't wait to hear about your big adventure. But before that, just like a little backstory. Where did you Where were you born and raised? I was actually born in North Ogden, Utah. And I lived up I lived in Utah until 2008. And then I moved up to the Pacific Northwest in 2008. So I have been in the Pacific Northwest for quite a while. So it is home. It's home for me. That's nice. And what drew you to Pacific Northwest originally like just to change or did you have a job? Well, I had gotten married, and then I was like, I want to get out. Get out of Utah. I want to be in Utah anymore. No offense, Utah. It's a gorgeous state. But when you're probably from somewhere, you're ready to kind of spread your wings a little bit, and I was ready for that. And it was a big adjustment though, up here. And I don't think it was until I actually started yoga. I went to grad school up here and then I started yoga while I was in grad school, and that's when I kind of felt like my life started to open up. It was interesting because I had been pretty You've social and outgoing in college and stuff. And then when I moved up here, I went through this, like, depression and a lot of anxiety almost to the point where it was, I couldn't even get on the like public transportation. And it was really like the yoga just like moved me out of that. And then the next thing I knew, like, I felt really inspired by the yoga. And then I found myself wanting to go to a training and I next thing I knew I was flying to Montreal, Canada to go to a backbending training called Jet A fight club with a Cirque Garcia so like, push me out of this deep funk I was in. Yeah. Understood did at this point. Had you done a yoga teacher training yet? Or did you know? So that was an I started yoga in 2012. My first type of yoga was Vikram yoga. It was in like the Bikram yoga heydays, when the studios everything was 90 minutes, and like 690 minute classes a day. And so yeah, I had a lot of depression, some a lot of anxiety. And I also had some scoliosis in my spine. And I saw a poster of Joseph and Senia, who was the 2010 world champion, within like a month of me practicing, and I was like, whatever that is, whatever he's doing, I want to do that. So I got interested in doing yoga championships, within just like a few weeks of me practicing and my practice was not like, remotely anywhere near that level. And I went to my studio owner, and I told her that I was interested. And she said, if you want to do the championships, you have to go to the 84 advanced class. And she said anyone can do it, you just gotta be willing to do it. And then then from that, at the time Aesop Garcia was training, a lot of competitors are champions through Jedi Fight Club. And so I was like, Okay, I'm gonna go to this. And I went to Montreal, completely lost all my bags. So I didn't have anything to like, practice with or do anything with. So my wonderful roommate at the time, let me borrow all her yoga clothes. And it was, like one of the biggest challenges I think ever. And I sat in the class and the events classes, and I watched other people do these postures that I now can do. And I just thought to myself, somehow, some way I'm going to, I'm going to do that to one day. And it's kind of just opened up from there was, was the sock, the one that was holding down the ad for classic OS and the classes that you're taking at that time? No, it was, yeah, he was rolling around. So he would train competitors. He does workshops all over the world. Within the yoga community. At that time, they had the ad for classes at the gym, yoga, Everett, and Jeremy Jones used to lead them and then the Kirkland studio here with Larissa Anderson. So it is kind of interesting to see, throughout the time period of me practicing the last 12 years, there have been different studios and different people who have kind of held the space for it and held the lineage. Because it is a very, it's a very special. It's not I wouldn't, I wouldn't say it's, it used to be more exclusive, because you could only be a competitor or teacher to go. Now it's opened up a bit, but there's something still very like sacred about it. And that space, and I think it's a huge honor, in the last few years to have been a leader in the 84 community up here. Also to mentor other teachers in to lead the ad for some very cool, amazing, I can tell people what the 84 series is to Great point. Let's not assume that anybody that you listening have no you might have no idea what that is. So please tell me tell me a little bit of history behind the 84 classic awesomeness series. Well, it's the most magical series I will say that but it is the original 84 postures from Vishnu Ghosh and the 26. Posture rooms known as most people as Bikram yoga came from a set of 32 postures from a book called Yoga cure by Bishnu Ghosh and Vishnu Ghosh was big grooms guru. And those 32 postures came from a complete set of 84 postures. Vishnu Ghosh is actually the brother of Paramahansa Yogananda. So most people are probably familiar with the Autobiography of a Yogi. And it's a really rich full series and a lot of Gosha students they used to kind of take this on the road and do demonstrations across India. So they even went Ghost Ghost lineage is derived from Calcutta. And they would even go to like Mysore and kind of demonstrate to the other lineages down there as well. So they'd have kind of their yoga offs at the time. So it is a stop there. But there's something I could sit here and tell you all the technical details about it. But when you practice it, there's something very uniquely energetically different about the series, this kind of wholeness and completion about the series. That I think that even if you don't dive further into the ad for I think having that experience just like once or twice, I think can energetically shift people, and in a huge way. Yeah, absolutely. Great description. I appreciate all that info. What what do you say? Like, you know, obviously, people are used to be some yoga and or words more commonly known as, like 26, and two or hot yoga. And then, you know, I think people doing the same pose twice, tend to, you know, get used to that routine. And then you go into something like where, like, you're saying the difference between 26 and then moving into the additional or going to the full 84 classic Asana? What do you what have you observed in leading those classes? Where the most growth comes from? Like, what are you witnessing your students? Like? What kind of reactions do you feel from them? Um, well, it's a smaller classes, of course, because the higher you go up the mountain, the less people are up at the top. And it's not necessarily at the top, but is a class about willingness. And it's two hours long. And it's usually at a time slot on the weekends when other people are going to be on their couch or just doing something else. So you have these people who are coming core, they also drive, it's not available at every studio, so they actually actually drive you know, 3045 minutes to get to it. So there's a certain level of devotion towards it, and then also play. And we're all struggling together. So it creates this kind of deep intimacy and bond. And in order to become good at something new, you have to agree to suck for a while at it, like you have to just suck for a while. And so if you're not willing to do that, if you're not willing to be vulnerable, then you'll never be great. So all these people who show up, they're willing to be vulnerable. The other challenge for me though, is like introducing some of these classes, like the advanced class intermediate classes, I have to keep the standard here, even when I witnessed people struggling or suffering a little bit. Because if I drop it, and I take away that struggle, then I weaken them. And so I have to keep it here so that they can rise up and I'm like, you know, I'm always willing to like, put my hand out and like help people come up. But I can't lower it. And so it also expands as a teacher, I'm witnessing their struggle. And that creates discomfort in me. So it also expands my capacity to feel that discomfort inside of me and to allow it to simply be without needing to remove it. Because like some of the best teachers that I've ever had, haven't removed the standard or the burden, or the struggle, but just held that space and the vision for myself to rise up. Otherwise they would have completely weakened me. Yeah, yeah, good point. Great points. I love it. The first time I got a chance to practice the ad for classic asanas was was with Jimmy Barkin in Fort Lauderdale. I started taking Bikram yoga classes in a town called Tequesta in Florida and then I would drive down to Fort Lauderdale which is about a hour and 15 minute drive away and I remember the first time being so blown away because you know obviously a lot of the poses in a for classic asanas are a little bit more exotic, right, like legs behind the head. All sorts of interesting positions that until then, and I remember in like in that time period, and like 2001 There really were there was no internet element. There was no YouTube, there was no books you could get that even had pictures at that point. Tony Sanchez hadn't really put his materials out. Maybe his poster was available. So I don't want to disrespect Tony. I don't remember what year actually no, that's not true. Because he had those VHS tapes. Do you remember that? How did you ever see the old though? I remember Yeah. Yellow and that was the like in 2012 That was like the only kind of thing I mean 2000 one's a little bit earlier but yeah, right. Yeah, like that to try and like yeah, he had a really work hard to find information. It was in the Like you said, the class really isn't offered readily in very many places. Like I would imagine a place like Seattle, which is I want to say a little more hip, in terms of like, in relation to different parts of the country, like you have a little bit of everything that you could want in places like Seattle and LA and that type of stuff. But for most of us out in the boondocks, there's really no, no way you would ever come in contact with the ad for classic Asana series. So I remember just being like, wow, this is something else. This is really, this is really powerful. That's cool. Can you tell me you made mentioned earlier about a two year journey? Can you talk a little bit about why you're feeling like it was such a journey? Well, around December of 2021, so I've been also doing yoga asana championships since 2012. And I got divorced in 2018 2018. And that was a huge shift in my world, products, so many things for me to heal. And then around December 2021, I felt like I needed to leave Seattle. And you know, still the pandemic was still kind of going on here. And I, it was hard, it was hard for me to leave, because I felt like a big devotion and responsibility to the community here. So I did train a couple other teachers who kept the 84 going. And I just felt like I needed to leave. So I put my stuff in storage. Well, prior, I was still debating. And then I said, you know, God, give me some kind of sign. And I walked out of the yoga studio, and I stepped on this piece of paper, and it said, eventually go find it. That's it. So I put my stuff in storage. And I went first to my dad's in Utah, and I had promised myself I will never move back home when I was 18. And then here, lo and behold, that time myself moving back home, and I stayed with my dad in Utah for six months. And while I was there, like I think I needed to be held by the mountains there, like the rocks, and I did some pretty heavy, letting go some like really suppressed energy like and just really very focused where the safety of my dad's house to be able to kind of bring up these things, this suppressed energy that I didn't really feel comfortable releasing at the time. And then I found my way. While I had thought I was going to move to Tennessee, so I went to Tennessee. Golf there, which part of Chattanooga beautifies but I got there and I was like, had my cats my Subaru full of stuff. And I was like this big. And what do you say this what? This was a mistake. I will feel it. You just did not feel. It was not until I called. I called my coach Kim Tang. And I said, you know, I was like, is there some like am I supposed to transmute this energy am I supposed to do so you know, I was asking all the stuff around her. And she said time to go baby girl. And I drove all the way to Joshua Tree, California and stayed with her at her retreat center. And this was just a few weeks before the national championships in 2022. And so my life had just like all the cards gone up in the air and then I found myself in Joshua Tree staying with her which was a lovely experience and so went to Nationals place second in nationals. That was my first time ever meddling in nationals after 10 years of Go For It trying every year. Yes, obviously maybe 2020 Didn't happen I'm guessing. Oh no 2020 Didn't happen. And I hadn't been invited to Nationals until 2015. So I started like last place in Washington and then wanted to work up into getting like, you know, in the top three in Washington state and then from there getting an invitation to Nationals and then from there being at Nationals then top 10 at Nationals and then meddling and so and then eventually my goal all along was I want to go to internationals. So I stayed with Kim and we went to internationals. She helped me train. So I was with her for about seven months. We went to Bangalore, India in December of 2022. And wow. That was an amazing experience. Maybe not what I wanted but exactly what I do. It's good old India for you. Yeah. Um, and I. So I placed third in the semi finals in the world championships. Congratulations. That's the final goal. And I fell out of my posture. So I knocked myself completely down. And it was super humbling for me, but also like, exactly what I needed. But I was up there and like this hot pink leotard in front of you know, all these Indian spectators just fall out of a posture. And like, you have to go all in. Yes, yes. Is that what you're after? Is that what you're alluding to? When you say I didn't get what I didn't it didn't go the way that I expected. I was expecting you to tell me like a dysentery story. Or like, Hey, I got horribly this or that, but but more just the experience of the actual competition itself? Well, yeah. That's your Bloods? Yes. What? Yes. Yeah, and you agree that you obsess over it, you think about it, you and you want to go up there. And more than just like winning, you want to give your best. And so when you kind of fall out of when you fall out of posture, it can be very disheartening, because you, you live for this moment. Um, but I think the true character of somebody is like, not what happens when you fall, it's what happens after you fall. And after I fall, I just fell, I just like got back in. And I finished off my routine and scored high on my last two postures, with a smile on my face, and then ran off stage behind the building, like, but that is like, that's the yogi moment right there. But I feel to that, you know, I've felt and I've fallen like, hundreds of times, and I think failure has always only ever made me limitless meaning like, if I had gotten what I wanted years ago, I wouldn't be the type of person or type of yogi or type of leader that I am today. It's been all those failures and those setbacks, that's like given me the most medicine, the most discomfort and in that discomfort, that's where our consciousness expands. And, you know, I've seen a lot of people come and go, who have maybe like natural talent or natural ability, and that's great. They get what they need from from the championships. But you kind of crack this limit in yourself, when you're forced to kind of sit with that discomfort inside yourself. Yes. Well said, well said, Jordan. I agree. 100%. That's cool. I mean, definitely when you have to work hard for something. And you. I mean, obviously, you, I'm sure you do have some natural ability, but at the same time, it sounds like you've also maybe not maybe not in comparison to some of the things we see when you get out with that world level. You know, you look and you go, Oh, my goodness, how am I going to go in this situation? These people are just like, ridiculously talented. And I'm just Who am I like, I'm not. I don't have that really crazy, natural ability. But then, like you said, to work so hard for that long and stay consistent and focused and not give up. It's just so rewarding. That's cool. I love hearing that. I do have to ask you a couple of questions just because I don't just want to see what you think about was Bikram at the Bangalore World Championships. To what, to what thank you i to what role does he get involved in any of this competition stuff? Roger Street was involved. And it kind of feels like the most harmonious like symbiotic, if that's the right word thing that Roger Street was involved because Roger Sri was a champion herself. And she's she's the one who's always kind of been very heavily involved in USA yoga. And it was actually really beautiful to see how honored she was there. And Bangalore. And so she was heavily involved. She kind of really helped to make the slash championships happen because you know, with COVID It went off track and there was a lot of people who have participated in it, but that hasn't been involved. Since the whole bubble burst. The registry was and I actually did get to travel with Roger Sri to from Bangalore to Calcutta and go to Ghosh college, but it was it was really beautiful to see how well received she was how honored. And we had this moment. You know, I was still kind of little in my fields and sad and disappointed but still at peace at the end and all the competitors were on stage and the participants in the audience and are the spectators in the audience saying the Indian national anthem to us and it was like one of the most beautiful things that I'd ever experienced. Wow. That's so cool. I really will say this though, too, because like, Tommy, so, so doing yoga competitions for 12 years now. I have gotten all sorts of comments about it. I have never gotten any pushback. From Indy, any Indian Yogi regarding yoga championships are yoga sport. So that's really cool to hear. I wanted to ask you about what type of criticisms you've heard. I remember, I got involved in the yoga competitions. When Bikram first started organizing them my my wife and I used to run the Bikram Yoga Studio in Mira Mesa in San Diego between 2002 and 2005. And so we would, I would drive up to La every week to take the advanced class and with with Bikram and Jason was teaching and me Cleves was teaching and Roger street would come in and practice and, and so I would drive, which is a really not fun drive. By the way, driving from San Diego to La back and forth, like the traffic, if you miss it, by like five minutes on the way home, like I'd be like, I have to be out at one o'clock. Because if I get on the freeway, one of seven, it would be like it took me for hours to get home. But, um, the the pressure, like just to kind of paint a little bit of picture. And this is obviously my personal experience. I would just like to hear what your feeling was, but it's a very high pressure environment, in my opinion, because it was like, very competitive, like really competitive like, and, and then just the paint on another little picture too. For those that are I don't know, like what does the competition look like? How do you even How do you even make yoga competition? The way that Bikram set it up was that it was you do five poses that were all compulsory. And then you pick to advance poses, it needs to be completed within What's the timeframe? Well, I don't know for your but it was it right now. It's three minutes, three minutes. So you have to complete these and I'm right with seven poses, am I correct? Five and two. Now it is well now it's a different format, but six, six postures in three minutes, but they're not the same five postures and then two optionals. That's they've changed the format, it's gotten increased. They've changed the format like almost every year I've done it, it's gotten increasingly like the bars kept going. What is it now. So you do six postures three minutes, you have to hold in stillness for at least five seconds in complete expression of the pose. And then there's a for me to demonstrate afford fold. So you have a choice of forward folds, meaning like the top four fold is lifting tortoise, then you have a track you have to do attraction posture, one of the top so you can do like upward stretching or one of the highest scoring traction postures is goodbye pose. You demonstrate a spine twist. So that will highest scoring spine twist will be full spine twist, you do a lift. So that could be own goodbye, peacocks. I do bow legged Peacock, and then an inversion my own version of choices Tiger Scorpion, and then a backbend. And the backbone I usually do is full will. So it's so it's gotten like increasingly like the bars been complete. Like I did remember I did start with the old traditional format of the five standard postures and then the two optionals. Gotcha. Yeah. Nice. And it's, it's, it is very intense to get on stage. Like you said, I liked the fact that you mentioned I was in a pink leotard in front of him, because I remember getting up in my Speedo which like for me to get into a speedo when I was kind of pressured to do it. That was a big moment for me because I was grew up surfing and wearing board shorts so if I wear a speedo to the beach to go surfing to there's no way anyone would have put up with that right like I would get heckled forever so like to actually get into a speedo and go into a yoga class like that was a big moment for me like I had a really like it was I don't know. Have you ever heard that from other guys? Do you ever what what kind of Well, I think I know it's silly. I know it's silly, because it's just like, whatever is your body and it's like a small little skimpy suit. But yeah. Well, and with India they have particular requirements for like, how are leotards were supposed to be and stuff like that. But it was funny because in the top 10 For the women, it was like, all of them were in black, and then me up there in this hot pink, looking like a flamingo out of my popsters Well, well, what Why did you wear the pink? If did you do it consciously? Or did you? Yes, you're allowed to write love, I love the pink. Yeah, it made me very happy to wear it. That's cool. Um, I do think though, when I first started yoga, and even the hot yoga, I would wear long pants and like a long sleeve shirt, and I felt very self conscious. And then you go in there, and it's this kind of survival atmosphere, like, these pants are not helping me survive, this shirts not helping me survive. And then you become, you're forced to look at yourself in the mirror and you see yourself for 90 minutes. And you either like learn to really love what's in front of you, or you decide you're going to change it. And so it's like this, I think it's even being up there in a leotard and stuff. It's like this kind of radical form of self acceptance, even though consciously and logically, I know that I have like an amazing and beautiful body, I still have my own insecurities that are still like there and present. And you're choosing to say like, so I'm gonna do it anyway, and just kind of built a lot of confidence in yourself in that capacity. I think everybody should have the opportunity to do their own kind of championships. It doesn't need to be yoga championships, but something that really forces them outside of their comfort zone, and has them adopt what I call like the champion mindset, because I look at myself as a champion. And it doesn't mean that I'm a champion only when I'm on stage, or standing on the X on stage or doing my routine, like it's a mindset with which I use in my life to like, overcome challenges. And I do have my moments where I fall victim to things and I'm like, I'm having enough, I'm tired of this, I can't do this when then I center again and remind myself like, No, you're a champion, and a champion rises in consciousness. So pull yourself together and rise. And that's what you do. Yes. Well said, I do want to talk about being competitive, please. Because a lot of people have been like, well, there's no competition in yoga, all this kind of stuff. And I think there's this tendency to, for us to kind of put this purity culture on yoga, when yoga sport and yoga championships, in their current form, are have been around in India for almost 200 years. And they have different formats. And so it's very interesting, because it's kind of a form of cultural misappropriation. And at the same time, it's not saying like, it's not it's yoga sport, not necessarily like yoga spirituality, we're not judging somebody's more spiritual or not, in that context. And for a while, I used to just be like, Oh, well, I'm just competitive with myself, which is true. But then I was like, I'm not actually being authentic and kind of owning the humaneness of me and this experience, which is, yeah, I am competitive. If there's somebody in class who's working hard next to me, I'm gonna work hard to and owning that, instead of like, pushing it away. That makes us a much more like whole and authentic person, then. And I do think there's like this healthy type of competitiveness. And that is probably the precise reason why we all enjoyed group practice, because you have somebody to push you to become more limitless. And that's like, that's what we're all striving for. And some of my like, biggest competition, like they're my friends, because we understand each other on such a unique level of obsession and drive and focus. And I'm so grateful to them because they've only made me better. They've only made me better. You can you can be inspired by it, or you can be defeated by it. And I choose to be inspired by it. Nice. So cool. Jordan. I was excited to hear your take on it. I was I was so curious. I was so excited to have this opportunity to speak with you because I don't often haven't chatted on the podcast with other folks. looks at have been involved in the competition. One thing that I remember feeling in coming out, I remember seeing after I went to the world's championship or competition, and that was held in Los Angeles one year, and there was people afterward crying, you know, and just really upset and based off of their performance. And I think for me personally, that was my turning point where I realized, I think I'm good. Like, that was really cool. I got a lot out of it. And I think I'm ready to just like not do this now. Have you had any? And I guess, the reason I bring up the crime part is because I when I saw people getting really upset about their lack of performance and ability, and I witnessed in myself to feeling like, Ah, I could have done so much better. Could have done some of that. And that it just made me turn a little bit of a corner. Have you had any of those feelings? And I don't, I don't know, judgment one way or the other. But I'm curious you do? What do you think? Um, I absolutely, absolutely. I think after India, I got kind of disappointed and depressed and burnt out. So I actually stayed in the desert, longer, and then I moved out to this little casita that was like down this dirt road, nobody around, I kind of wanted to just not be with anybody. And I just sat there. And there was a bush in front of my patio and these beautiful boulders in Joshua Tree. And I just felt like Moses up there, I was just talking to the bush, you know, talking to God, letting it all out, letting all this disappointment, this frustration, this depression out. But it's like, the path of it, you know, like, it's, it's a tool or a mechanism to become a new version of ourselves, or new identity. And so, when I no longer love it, when I feel like the desire has extinguished out, I'm not going to, I'm not going to keep going for it, I'm not going to keep doing it. I never am forcing myself to do it. And so last year, I did take it take a break, I took it off, and I rested. And I allowed myself to just like be in the desert and surrender to those feelings. And I don't think that I think that it's like this this microcosmic of this human experience. And being attached and learning to not be attached and but allowing ourselves to fill it all because that's exactly like why we're here is to have that expand our capacity to fill to fill everything to free ourselves from it. And so for me, it's like been one of the biggest tools for expansion for me. And particularly, so yeah, I was I was very attached towards it. And I had to learn afterwards, that I'm okay, no matter what, I even went through this period of like, do I even like yoga anymore, and all this kind of stuff, and just completely losing myself for a while. And then rooting back into my wholeness, and then everything kind of coming back in again, in that passion reigniting, and, oh, I love 84. And, you know, just returning back again to that. But it's that process. And it's that trusting of the process and knowing that whatever is coming up, whatever I'm feeling, whether it's depression, disappointment, frustration, defeat, it is part of it. There's nothing wrong with it. But that seed of desire that you throw down there, this is part of it at that purification. And so in the desert, I felt like it was the way of the fire. It was the purification of myself. And so I think, I think it's all exactly how it needs to be in everybody's reactions and it needing it to be anything different. But at the end of the day, I just truly love it. And if I stop loving it, then I'll stop. Nice. Yeah, I like the way you process it though process to and I think that's really cool. That it's also to like, I was thinking that maybe it was like a little bit of a dark night of the soul sort of experience. Like when you're saying like, do I even like yoga like, what the heck am I doing? I mean, I've had quite a few I will say, my, um, the end of my marriage was probably like the absolute most excruciating thing I've ever been through. And I think it was like that champion mindset and the stuff that you learn in that Chrome that like, actually pulled me out of that that, like, I knew how I knew how to rise and root root into myself and rise from that. And yeah, so I did have a long dark night of the soul after the championships, but it was, it was like it was just another layer to peel off in myself. So, yeah, nice. Yeah, awesome. So many questions. One, another one. How would you stay the current Bikram yoga community? And then maybe I should preface it seems like when I'm noticing that people are more affiliating themselves as a Bishnu Ghosh College of India of of 84. asanas? And so which I agree with 100%. That makes perfect sense. What are your thoughts? Well, I do have a lot of thoughts on this. Are you ready for it? Do you feel like you have to be diplomatic? I mean, don't you feel like when we started treading down this path a little? I don't know. Like, I don't know, if I asked you something that you don't feel comfortable with? I know, you'll tell me. I don't know. Thank you. And we'll move on. But thank you, it sounds like you're ready to speak. So I think every Bitcoin practitioner, when everything came out in 2013, I did have to grapple with some kind of like, identification, or what is the yoga means to me and I at that time, I had only been practicing a year, but what I had experienced at the studio that I practiced that was just pure love inclusion. And just like this rich, rewarding experience. I did have a student in class, I was it, I set it up, I made a joke about being a drum teacher, and how it being a little bit harder to be liked. And they're like, Well, you know that Grimm was a rapist and this right in the middle of class, right? It's a vos, and I'm like to Whoa, okay, off balance a little bit, I took a second to take a deep breath. And I said, the shame of the Guru is not the shame of the lineage, or the shame of the community. I think that's a really big important distinguish, thing to distinguish, because that is putting all of our power and investment in a man and a person and a human instead of what we really need to be doing is like putting our power in ourselves and power in God universe, source, whatever you want to call it, and returning back to ourselves. If people want to move on from the practice, or if they want to separate themselves from that, that you do you like, that's, that's fine. I also, I am comfortable using the term background because it's like, I don't need to. It's an integration of the truth of the history, instead of just pretending that it never happened. Or so it's like kind of owning, owning that owning the truth of like, where this came from, and an ad for all talk about go shall talk about background, I'll talk about the lineage, I'll talk, I'll give them the whole history of even Seattle, where the ad force, then at which studio, which people have been the leaders of it, because it's important to know. And I think it's just like getting out our own discomfort to sit with kind of the paradox of things, which is like this rich, beautiful yoga, that's given us so much. And then some of the more unsavory aspects, the more human aspects of it, as well. But again, expanding our range and capacity to be able to hold it all the light and the shadow, then the pain and the joy, the grief and the love. So that's kind of like my thing is like, I will appropriate it to gauche, I'll introduce my 26 classes as HOFA 26, go to that grim, whatever you want to call it like it. But I do think it's important for us to own our history and also to know that the shame of the Guru is not the shame of a lineage or shame of community and there's a fallen guru in almost every lineage. So it's it's a thing, I think it's something that each lineage has to grapple with at one point or another, which is the the flaws of man and how do we how do we how do we deal with that? How do we take responsibility accountability, to community to protect, to not allow people to abuse their power, and then also to not throw away the medicine at the same time. Hope I answered that well, very well. I can't help but think that you're a gifted speaker like you are good. You can vocalize and verbalize what you're thinking very clearly and smoothly. So well done. Jordan, I really appreciate your perspective. That's so cool. And I think you're right. I think every I agree with everything you said. I'd found a hard time with it personally. And interestingly enough, when when my wife and I were holding down the studio and Mira Mesa, we started going well, let's go to India. And we really wanted to practice Ashtanga with batavi Joyce and we went to Mysore and practice with batavi Joyce and I remember just kind of coming from the Bikram rawness being like oh, this is so heavy because I remember watching Bikram do stuff with people that I was like, something's not right here, man, something's gonna fall apart. This is not cool, whatever he's doing this doesn't feel right. And, um, but then there's been a whole blow up in the Ashtanga world. And so after I had double guru blow up, I thought, What do I do? Ah, but I liked the fact that I liked that you're being so real about it. And I also liked that you brought up the kind of cultural appropriation element of people saying like, you know, competition, that's not spiritual. But interestingly enough, like when we look at even some of the festivals in India, like the you know, the really big ones of the KU Mela, you know, there's a lot of Yogi's there that are demonstrating their abilities, and they attract their followers by demonstrating their abilities. And so competition seems like it's been a part of yoga, ever since the very beginning. I mean, so I think I like the fact that you're bringing to light that I'd be doing myself a disservice by not acknowledging that I do appreciate having somebody next to me, that's also trying really hard. And when I'm trying really hard through an inspiring me, it's not that I'm really trying to beat them, or prove to them that I'm better, because I can hold it longer, I can straighten my leg more, or I can squeeze my quad while I straighten my leg or whatever. So I liked that you brought that distinction up in that department and also the way that you're really loving the yoga and also I like that you brought up the the idea within the challenge of the class because every time what will happen is like data for classic asanas is challenging, but if you water it down, I do appreciate that you're trying to hold the bar to a certain level for the benefit of the students that the growth potential still there as opposed to just placating to the students challenge in that moment in time. So all amazing points, I love it. Now, I noticed that I want to bring up two things that I mean the links are going to be in the description so everybody can click and follow you or find you. In your your website is Jordan Lydia taro.com So when I went to your website, like first I kind of heard from your Seattle student that he kind of said like wow, you know, Jordan is like you really got to talk to her because she's so focused and she's worked so hard and she was really dedicated teacher and practitioner and so then when I went to your website to do a little research or find out about you and then I saw that you have a lot going on and you also seem to be involved in like gentle yoga and or yin yoga and or this element of taro. So I would just want to ask you a couple like just find out like what what else do you do? I mean, I love playing with energy I am I have actually been teaching in yoga, the longest and I love absolutely love yoga nidra. So I do have this whole other kind of like softer side as well. Being silk, both strong and soft. And, but recently, like, I am really interested in a lot in what I would call like remote, energetic healing. And I've really been devoting myself to a lot of like, accessing the subconscious mind, or I call it quantum field healing. And it's a technique that I do, where if I get still enough, I can take my energy quantum field and access somebody else's quantum filled and fill where there's constriction or pain in their body through my body, and also begin to kind of shift it. I think Taro is a very good tool as well because the visual representations are a little bit more tangible to people than just like talking about these like subtle energy, things and so it is all kind of this. They're all representations I would say of like one consciousness and with yoga nidra In particular, like working through the different coaches or layers of the body, and I love channeling that I love having that come in as well. So there's a lot of different kinds of experiences that I've had on the energetic side of things. And so it's how to really purify myself to be able to do that for other people more. And part of being in the desert was a lot of like nervous system regulation to be able to expand my capacity to be able to offer that for a larger community of people. Yes, very cool. And you're going to be leading a retreat in Joshua Tree soon, is that true? Well, that will be in the fall, it's called limitless, and it will be at four every day. And then also yin yoga every day. So part of championship training is that I have used yin yoga to open up my body in in a lot of different ways. So it's not necessarily in yoga isn't necessarily in alignment based practice, but you can use it to create better alignment. So I had scoliosis in my spine. So it's like back bending, to reshape my spine, and then my yin to realign my pelvic girdle. And I think the combination of the two is amazing. But I'm also open, I'm always open to any kind of new ways to open the body and create, I think we're all moving towards his freedom. So that that will be it. And it will also be a discussion of kind of Limitless Mindset, like what is the mindset that you need not need, can adopt in your life to be able to transform your life, because it's not really about the yoga, it's not really about what happens on the mat. It's those that cultivation of self that you learn on the mat that you then take outside to the rest of the world. Yes. Can you tell me what type of thoughts you've had spending time in Joshua Tree? Oh, so many thoughts? Okay. Um, the desert. The desert can be a very masculine, prickly place where people like it wants to protect itself. And the more that you try and protect yourself, the more the desert will pull from you. But when you surrender to the desert, the desert becomes very soft and open and expansive. And the sunsets are, you know, this beautiful pink hue and oranges and purples and the people there in Joshua Tree, are there people who I would say like, maybe went, had their soul go bankrupt in like a big city or something. So they're kind of looking to draw back into the earth and they're really creative and artistic and just inspirational people all like put in one place. But I think the time spent in like the desert and with, with the little jackrabbits or seeing coyotes go by, or the bush like in listening to the wind, and like, I just feel like the wind is like the breath of God in the desert and you feel like yes, the desert so hot and extreme, but then God sends the wind down to Coolio. And it's like this beautiful gift. I do. I do have an appreciation of the tough times to go to the desert. Let me know it was time to go. Yeah, I went out there last spring and I was taking my son to go see Joshua Tree. And I went up from like the west side. I injured him from the west side, not the Twentynine Palms side, but the other side and it was the weather was horrible. It was raining, it was really just like a kind of like, not very good visibility day. And so we're driving in, I'm like, sorry, you know, this probably isn't the best time to do this. But I'm like, we got to do this. You got to see this. And so as we were, we were driving through we got a little bit further in the clouds parted. And the sun and after the after it rained and the way the rain was glistening on all of the, the those little cactus that are I know there's lots of cactus, but I can't remember what the names of the ones are. But yeah, and it was just like, the sun. It was like, Oh my gosh, so beautiful. It was just stunning. And I left there. When we left. I was like, I want to spend more time in Joshua Tree. I think everybody should live in the desert at least once in their life. It's almost like all the sages all of the like prophets, and like Jesus, they all went and spent time in the desert. It's a place. What I say is it's a place where you go to empty yourself. And that's what I did. I had to empty myself. I had to lose everything while I was there. Just empty, empty, empty, and then it just like love comes back into you. Nice. So I feel like everybody should go live in the desert at least once in their life. Yeah. What is it? What is it day in your life look like in relation to your wakeup schedule slash practice, teach schedule slash over anything else that you do? Like, what time do you get started, I get started around 6am, I do have a corporate job, I work as a medical device industry. i Since moving back to Seattle, I live three blocks from the Puget Sound. So I actually have been going and jumping in the water in the winter called plunging swimming around for about, you know, 10 to 15 minutes. And that is an amazing way to start the day. Nice. Then I, you know, do my job, I will get a Moksha throughout the day, everybody knows I have a much at the column I like which is t. And around like four o'clock I finish up and depending on the day, maybe I'm teaching, I usually try to or I usually do about an hour, at least of stretching or some kind of training, then maybe it can be myself teaching or taking a class last night I took three classes. You took three classes, three classes, three hot yoga classes. I'm 26 into a ghost flow class. And then the last class was African kinetic yoga, if you've never tried African kinetic yoga, energetically, that is that is just it's an amazing, you feel so regal and Royal. So there's a plug for kinetic yoga and there is an Egyptian. Yeah, so the between that is feeling that the the yoga was actually actually derived from Egypt. And so the shapes are very though there's kind of some similarities. But that is also very like, the way like you put your hands it's very jet geometrically. And so you feel this total alignment in your body, and just the stability and regal Venus in your body as well. I also do some energy clearing for myself. And lately, I morning and night had been writing down my fears and resentments and asking God to help me release them and asking, when I say God, I mean energy or universe, not necessarily particularly like our purse persona. Like a man with a beard, holding a light, you know. Here's another I also grew up Mormon. So I left I left a religion so left America's left to religion like a lot, a lot of big changes I've gone through in my life. And that is a big one. Right? If you've were indoctrinated into Mormon culture, it is kind of a big deal to become a Yogini. Yes. Does do your do your parents frown upon this? Are they open and loving that might be taking us down a really windy road, because I always start talking about parents. But welcome, oh, sorry. Like both of my parents are still within the Mormon religion, but they have they love and accept me. But I think it also comes from the love and acceptance that I have shown myself. Yeah. And but it was, well, the the point for me of decision is I felt like I had, I was still going through the motions of religion. And then in 2013, I was in an 84 class. And I was like, Why do I feel God here on my map, when I'm sweating, and I feel this connection here. But I don't feel God in church. And it was at that point that I made the decision to leave because I realized my heart wasn't all in. And I'm a woman who goes all in on whatever I'm doing. And so I needed to make that decision. But my parents have been both loving and accepting. But I think it's also a reflection of the love and acceptance I've had to cultivate with myself. And that's one of the things that I've worked very hard on is no longer self rejecting. And really owning owning myself. Oh, yeah. Well said. That's a good point. That's making me think about maybe ways that I've, maybe all I need to do is shift toward giving myself a little more love, and then I won't think that I'm doing something for somebody else. That makes sense. That's cool. Oh, man, Jordan. I don't want our time to end we're getting close to our hour. I want to keep talking but I want to be respectful of your time as well. Do. I feel like you brought spring so much to the plate here? I mean, giving us encouragement to like, even though we got to work hard, don't give up, and a little more self love and take time to go on retreat and listen to nature. And is there anything else that you feel called to share before we exit? Well, that was like, maybe not maybe like, we hit all the, we hit it off, I was gonna say something, which is I think competition is an is the order of nature. And to deny ourselves that, like we aren't competitive is to deny nature, like everything in nature, is in competition. But that that is okay. And I think I think it's about that thing externally is only a representation of something that you put internally. So it's not about overcoming the other person. It's about overcoming yourself, overcoming who you view yourself to be. And it can be in any area of, of your life, whether that be in romantic relationships, friendships like work, health, finances, whatever it may be, it's just like this. We came here to overcome, you know, we were in a state of bliss, and bliss got boring, so we needed to shake it up. And so sometimes when I feel very frustrated, or upset, or sad or depressed, I put my hand on my heart and I say, like, I can be here for myself, I can stay here for myself. And I think it's about learning to not abandon ourselves. And that's what the Bikram yoga or cold plunges, teaches you to do is to not abandon yourself to the external conditions, and to stay with yourself. And when I feel like I just my mind wants to get out of a posture, but my body is okay. But my mind is ready to get out like, like a bat out of hell. I will just start to spell s. T. A, why stay? And I think that's really what about what it is, especially in like a hot yoga, the Bikram yoga, you're staying with yourself, or even in a yoga posture, those aren't necessarily easy. They can be very uncomfortable. And the time at time is creating this external condition for you to learn how to stay with yourself, to not abandon yourself at all. And I'm not saying to like push through when you're, but we all know those that time when the mind just wants to leave. But the body's like this. There's medicine here. Let's stay a little bit longer. So yeah, perfect. I know it's an adventure. Why not? Yes. Oh, man, Jordan, thank you so much. I really, you know, as you were saying that reminded me when I or reminded me, it made me think of when I reached out to you via email, your response was when I asked would you be willing to be a guest on my show? He said, all my body says yes. And or something to that effect. And and I've never had anybody respond like that, in a way that it was kind of cool, because it made me think that you're listening to your body, like, what was your what was the visceral reaction? And so you're like, Yeah, I want to I do. So I thought, Oh, how cool is that? I like that. Good response. Yeah. Well, I think as movers or Yogi's, we make decisions with our body. And sometimes our mind is going to be anxious towards something, and bring up all these fears and doubts and resistance. But when you get calm enough, your body already knows the decision. And I'm not saying there. I don't think yoga is the path Yoga is not the path of least resistance, because you're actually going into resistance. In 10, intentionally, you're putting yourself into resistance intentionally and then staying with yourself. But we all know, deep in our body and connecting to that wisdom of our body, the decisions that we should make the directions that we should go. And yeah, I think when I moved back to Seattle, I was moving from Joshua Tree in October and going back into Seattle, during the darkest time of the year in Seattle. And my mind was like, because I know it sounds like what are you doing? Right now? Everybody's going to Joshua Tree right now, not to Seattle. Like you need to go. And I listened to that and it's actually it's been a great decision for me nice. When my mind was like, No, we can't do this body's like, go in this direction. Again. Absolutely. That's cool. Jordan, thank you so much for taking time to speak with me. And I'm so excited to have this opportunity I can't wait to. I've never been to Seattle. If I do get a chance to get out there, I will find out where you're teaching and come take class. It'd be it. You have such a great voice. I think I can see ya. coming together to the point will Copeland I'm slowly starting to get more and more into that. I know being a Florida person, it's um, that's a big challenge for me. But I did. I was up in Michigan recently in the winter and I did jump in the lake there. Because I interviewed a guy over in Finland, named mountainous Apple Berg, who goes in the freezing water every single day of the year, even in the middle of winter when it's like brutal in Finland. I was like, Okay, I think I can go into like, what's if it's 40 degrees in Michigan, that's nothing compared to like, Sub Zero ice blending. So I'm into and I've heard it's great for depression to like a hero like does a great job for regulating the mood and just making you feel good. So that sounds cool. Awesome, Jordan. I really enjoyed this. Thank you so much. Until next time. Native yoga Todd cast is produced by myself. The theme music is dreamed up by Bryce Allen. If you liked this show, let me know if there's room for improvement. I want to hear that too. We are curious to know what you think and what you want more of what I can improve. And if you have ideas for future guests or topics, please send us your thoughts to info at Native yoga center. You can find us at Native yoga center.com. And hey, if you did like this episode, share it with your friends, rate it and review and join us next time